MyBump2Baby Podcasts Mon, 16 May 2022 17:22:45 +0000 en hourly 1 MyBump2Baby Podcasts 32 32 Domestic Abuse Mon, 16 May 2022 17:20:16 +0000 Today we speak with Rachael Carter from Gomer Williams Solicitors in Swansea about domestic abuse, what it is, what the different types are, how to recognise it and when to seek legal advice plus much more.

The post Domestic Abuse appeared first on MyBump2Baby Podcasts.

  • Domestic Abuse

Today we speak with Rachael Carter from Gomer Williams Solicitors in Swansea about domestic abuse, what it is, what the different types are, how to recognise it and when to seek legal advice plus much more.

For more info: 

Telephone : 01554 755101

Email :



[00:00:00] Carla: My Bump 2 Baby is one of the UKs leading parenting platforms. You can find local pregnancy to preschool groups, classes, and lessons, wherever you are in the UK. Not only that, but you can read our honest reviews on the latest products, days out and services that you as parents need to know about. We also work with trusted financial advisors, family law, solicitors, and now estate agents, too.

[00:00:33] If you would like to find your nearest, trusted expert, head over to

[00:00:46] Are you a parent looking to start a small business, perhaps you’ve no idea where to start. Or maybe you’ve already got a small business and you’re struggling to take it to that next level. My bumps baby is here to support you. My pumped baby business offers training packages, mentorship programs, one-to-one support, and e-courses, if you would like more information on how to grow your business with my bump to baby.

[00:01:19] Then email us. Our email address is

[00:01:35] Hello, and welcome to My Bump 2 Baby Expert podcast, where we bring experts from all over the UK to answer your questions on everything, pregnancy to preschool.

[00:02:02] Today we are joined by the lovely Rachel Carter from Gomer Williams Solicitors. Today, we’re going to be talking all about domestic abuse, what it is, what the different types are and how to recognise it when you’re in it.

[00:02:21] Hello everybody. And welcome to My Bump 2 Baby’s Expert podcast. Today, I am joined by the lovely Rachel Carter from Gomer Williams Solicitors, and we are talking about domestic violence and injunctions. Hi, Rachel, how are you? 

[00:02:38] Rachael: Oh, hi, I’m okay. Thank you. How are you?

[00:02:40] Carla: I’m very well, thank you. I think this is a really important subject to discuss. So, um, as, as strange as it sounds, I’m actually really looking forward to talking to you about this subject, because there’ll be so many people in this situation. Um, it’s really important. 

[00:02:56] Rachael: Yeah. Yeah, no, it’s such an important conversation to have. 

[00:02:59] Carla: Definitely. So, Rachel, can you just tell us a little bit about you just before we begin?

[00:03:05] Rachael: Yeah. So I’m a solicitor, I’m a director of Gomer Williams Solicitors. I been a solicitor for coming up to four years and I’ve got eight years of experience dealing with domestic violence and children matters and all aspects of family law really.

[00:03:21] Carla: Brilliant. Thank you very much for that. So Rachel we’ll get started with the podcast. So first of all, um, can you explain what domestic abuse actually is for those that might not know?

[00:03:32] Rachael: Yeah. So domestic abuse is defined as a pattern of behavior and it’s used to gain or maintain power and control over a partner so it can affect anyone. And it affects everyone regardless of their race, age, sexual orientation, religion, or gender. So people seem to think that it’ll target a certain individual, but it can really affect anyone. 

[00:03:54] Carla: Yeah. Yep. I know that, that’s it. I mean, there’s more and more, um, programs on the TV lately that are showing all different types of abuse as well, because it’s not just, you know, the physical violence, there’s so many different forms of abuse isn’t there. So onto, onto that now, what, what are the different types of domestic abuse, Rachael? 

[00:04:16] Rachael: So there are lots of different types of domestic abuse. So just to give some examples is coercive control. So that could include intimidation, isolation control, and that’s with a threat of, um, physical or sexual violence. Um, there’s psychological abuse or emotional abuse. Um, there’s financial abuse, harassment, stalking, but the main one that people seem to think of when you think of the abuse abuse, sorry is physical violence because that’s where the injuries are. Um, and often then the other sorts of domestic violence then get overlooked.

[00:04:50] Carla: Yeah. Yeah. I think, um, I think a lot of people. When they are in a domestic abusive relationship, it can take them a while to realize if it isn’t physical, because it’s kind of slowly gets to that point. And the people that we’ve spoke to on our other podcast before they almost didn’t realize that they were in it at the time until so many things happened.

[00:05:12] Rachael: Yeah. And when you speak to people, you’ll say, oh, is there any domestic abuse involved and they’ll say oh no they’ve never hit me. And then it goes beyond that it goes beyond just hitting someone. 

[00:05:23] Carla: Yeah. Yeah, definitely. So, so how would someone recognise if they’re in a domestic abusive relationship? It sounds really kind of, people listening that haven’t been in that situation might think, oh, well you just know, but, but how, how would someone recognise that? 

[00:05:40] Rachael: Yeah. So there are many ways to recognise some of the signs of harm or abuse. I mean, like I just said with the emotional abuse and psychological abuse, that’s a bit more harder to identify, but what you’re really looking for is that you may hear, or you may see something between the perpetrator or the victim.

[00:05:57] Um, it may be that the victim does come to talk to you about it, or it could be that a family or friend of the victim will, may tell you something which alerts you to it. Um, like I said earlier, you could see the visible injuries, or it could just be that you noticed that something’s not quite right between the either the victim or the abuser. And that could just quite alert ,if there’s something not quite wrong, sorry. There’s not quite right. And it’s something could be wrong. 

[00:06:22] Carla: That’s it. Cause sometimes, um, the abusers are very good at disguising. You know, that they are an abuser really. So sometimes it can be quite difficult to recognise as well. What would someone do if they’re struggling to know if they’re in a domestically abusive relationship? 

[00:06:39] Rachael: So this is quite hard, like you said earlier, once you’re in a domestic abuse relationship, sometimes you can’t see it yourself and you almost need to take a step back. Um, and there is gaslighting as well. And what that will do is it’ll make you question your. Your own beliefs and your own thoughts and feelings and it’ll make you think whether you are actually in the wrong and you’ll have thoughts such as am I overreacting, or was I being too sensitive? Am I being crazy? And all of those sorts then will affect your ability to be sure that the relationship is abusive.

[00:07:11] Um, but what I tell a lot of my clients says, well, if someone was coming to speak to you and they were telling you the situation that you’re in at the moment, what would your advice be to them? Would you be saying actually that’s not right. That’s abusive or would you be saying, yeah, that all sounds fine. And I think it is important to speak out to people, speak to whoever you can, whether it’s family, friends, colleagues, professional support, such as doctors, midwives, health visitors. There is everyone there for you, um, to talk to. 

[00:07:39] Carla: Yeah, that’s great advice. I think sometimes it can be when we’ve spoken to parents before that are in, abusive relationships, sometimes they don’t really want to admit to family and friends because they might sort out the relationship and stuff like that. But, but I mean, it is there is, a lot of, a lot of people that don’t doesn’t have to be family or friends, does it then really in, in regards to speaking to someone. 

[00:08:02] Rachael: No, no, definitely though. There’s a lot of professionals out there and there’s lots of domestic violence organisations that you can speak to as well. And you can hide your identity as well. And there’s, there’s steps that can be put in place to make sure that you’re in a safe environment to speak to them as well. 

[00:08:19] Carla: Brilliant. That’s really useful. So why would someone then seek legal advice for domestic abuse? 

[00:08:27] Rachael: So there’s many different reasons why they would want legal advice in respect to domestic abuse. It may be that they’ve come to me. Um, and they’re thinking about ending the relationship and they want to know what steps can be put in place for them to leave the relationship safely. Especially when there’s children involved, a house involved. How that will look. Again, you need to look at where you would go when the relationship was to break down.

[00:08:50] Um, is it safe for you to stay in the home, whether you need to go to a refuge just in order to keep safe, um, or there’s other options available such as non molestation orders and occupations orders as well, which are order, applications made to the court to protect the victims. 

[00:09:06] Carla: Great. Great. Just, just a bit more detail on those that you just mentioned. So what, what is a non-male molestation order then? 

[00:09:14] Rachael: So a non molestation order would be stop an abuser from using or threatening uh, physical violence, intimidating behaviour harassing, pestering or communicating with the victim. It can also stop the abuser from coming within a certain distance of the victim, their home, or even attending a place of their work.

[00:09:33] Carla: That’s great. Yeah. So, so would someone apply for that then? And how long roughly would that take or does it all depend? 

[00:09:41] Rachael: Um, so it all depends on the circumstances, but there are options available where you can do a, a without notice application to the court. So that would be when you’re in fear for your safety. And, what the court can do is list it say within 24 to 48 hours, they can list it sometimes without the respondent being aware of it. So it’s a without notice hearing. Um, they can make that non molestation order. And then what you would need to do that is go back to the court for a return date. And that would give the respondent then an opportunity to inform the court of any arguments against the need for non molestation order. But the victim has got that security for the non molestation order in place until the matter next goes before the court. 

[00:10:27] Carla: That’s really useful. Um, because I think if, if someone was thinking of leaving an abuser, they could turn quite nasty. Couldn’t they at that stage. So.

[00:10:35] Rachael: Yeah. The other sorts of order available is there’s an occupation order. And that regulates who then lives in the family home. And that’s regardless of whether they live in it solely or jointly. So what it will do is exclude the abuser from the family home. It may be that they need permission to enter the property. Or like I said earlier, exclude them from a defined area where the property is located. So again, that could be for a specified period or just until a further order is made. 

[00:11:05] Carla: Right. Okay. So, so at what point then, um, Rachel, what they have to tell their abuser about this. So say for example, um, someone wanting to leave tomorrow and, while their abusers at work, what, what, what point would they have to make that contact and tell them what they’re doing? Cause I imagine that’s quite scary for someone that’s in an abusive relationship. 

[00:11:26] Rachael: So what they would need to do, they would need to consider. At the relationship ending, are they going to remain in the property and see if they can deal with it amicably? Will the abuser become violent or threatening or intimidating? Is it best for them to leave the property? Find somewhere safe to go, whether it’s with a family, a friend or even a refuge whilst they’re making that decision. Um, and it may be that things settle down after a few weeks or months, but it may be then that they do need to consider a non molestation, an occupation order if things don’t go amicably. 

[00:12:00] Carla: That’s great. That’s great. And is there any other places in the local community that you can recommend if someone is really struggling? 

[00:12:08] Rachael: So there’s lots of domestic violence organisations out there, and I know that you can go in for face-to-face meeting, or I know you can speak to them online or telephone. So there’s lots of different ways to get in touch with people, as well as the GP and other professionals who are there to give you advice. 

[00:12:25] Carla: That’s brilliant. And Rachel, how can you help people in this situation then? 

[00:12:30] Rachael: So what we can do is we can arrange a free half hour an appointment to discuss the circumstances, discuss the finances. Cause there is legal aid available in some circumstances. So for on some passported benefits or on low-income. Um, and if they don’t have any savings then it may well be that they’re entitled to legal aid. Um, so we can discuss that with them. If they’re not entitled to leg aid, we can discuss the fees, um, that they would need to pay, and we can talk them through how to file the application at court, and the representation throughout and what that means.

[00:13:03] Carla: Yeah. So I imagine everyone’s situation may be different because if you’re married, then it would be a case of you, you do this and then you might think about, right, well, we’re going to get divorced now. And then there’s obviously the house to kind of work out and finances, like you said.

[00:13:18] Rachael: Yeah. And then after obviously the initial safety periods, we need to consider the children as well and where the children would be on the separation, whether they would say with the abuser or the victim and how that would impact on the children and the contact that they would have with the other parent. 

[00:13:36] Carla: Rachael, can you just explain, sorry, just one last thing. Um, a little bit about what legal aid is, um, for those that don’t really know. 

[00:13:45] Rachael: Yes. So what that means is that, that they wouldn’t have to pay us anything and we can reclaim our costs from the legal aid agency. So with other types of family law, you would need evidence of domestic violence, but for domestic abuse, for the non molestations orders and the occupation orders, it’s just means and merits tested. Um, so financially they would have to have savings of less than 8,000 pounds. And we would have to have a look at their income as well to see whether they were on a supporting benefit or if they are working and whether they would be in the scope to get legal aid.

[00:14:19] But what that means is we could apply to the legal aid agency and if they had a legal aid certificate, it means that they wouldn’t have to pay anything. And that we could reclaim our costs or in some circumstances they may be required to pay a contribution towards their legal fees, but the majority of the fees would be funded by the legal aid agency.

[00:14:39] Carla: Well, that has been really, really useful. Rachel, can you, can you just tell people where they can find you? So if they are in this situation, they can reach out and have that half an hour chat with you. 

[00:14:52] Rachael: Yeah. So we’ve got offices based in Llanelli. Um, um, our telephone number is 01554755101. So they can telephone the number to make a free half hour appointment, or we have got am email address as well.

[00:15:07] Carla: That’s great. Rachel, what I’ll do is I’ll pop the email address on the bottom of the, of the podcast notes so that people can just click it and be able to access it. It’s click to call and also contact you directly with that email address if that’s okay. And I’ll also, I’ll also put the website on as well, if that’s all right. And then. People can contact you that way. Thank you so much. And also, would you mind just telling us a little bit more about Gomer William solicitors and what else you can help with? 

[00:15:37] Rachael: Yeah, so we deal with a whole range of legal services. So we do, um, in the family department, deal with children matters to the child arrangements order. Which are important then when considering a breakdown in the relationship, as well as cohabitation disputes, and, um, divorce, we also deal with conveyance and then when it comes to, um, separating the houses or buying a new property, um, wills and probate is another thing that would need to consider upon the breakdown of the relationship. 

[00:16:09] Carla: That’s brilliant. That’s really useful today. Rachel. Thank you so much for sharing all that information with us. 

[00:16:16] Rachael: That’s okay. That’s no problem at all. 

[00:16:18] Carla: Thank you. 

[00:16:21] Thank you for listening to My Bump 2 Baby’s expert podcast. If you would like to find help and support from experts in your local area, head over to and you will also be able to find local pregnancy to preschool groups, classes, businesses, and services in your local area.

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No Fault Divorce Sun, 15 May 2022 10:51:27 +0000 Today we are joined by Lisa Dawson from Ellisons Solicitors, Lisa answers all our questions on no fault divorce, what it means, how you can apply and other important questions.

The post No Fault Divorce appeared first on MyBump2Baby Podcasts.

  • No Fault Divorce

Today we are joined by Lisa Dawson from Ellisons Solicitors, Lisa answers all our questions on no fault divorce, what it means, how you can apply and other important questions. 

What is a no fault divorce? 

When did a no fault divorce become law? 

When can I apply for a no fault divorce?

How much is a no fault divorce? 

How long does a no fault divorce take?

What effect will it have? 

Does that mean that people won’t be able to rely on domestic abuse in the process of their divorce? 

What else you offer?

T: +44 (0)1206 719637
F: +44 (0)1206 710295
A: Ellisons Solicitors, Headgate Court, Head Street, Colchester, Essex, CO1 1NP 


[00:00:00] Carla: My Bump 2 Baby is one of the UKs leading parenting platforms. You can find local pregnancy to preschool groups, classes, and lessons, wherever you are in the UK. Not only that, but you can read our honest reviews on the latest products, days out and services that you as parents need to know about. 

[00:00:24] We also work with trusted financial advisors, family law, solicitors, and now estate agents, too. If you would like to find your nearest, trusted expert, head over to

[00:00:46] Are you a parent looking to start a small business, perhaps you’ve no idea where to start. Or maybe you’ve already got a small business and you’re struggling to take it to that next level. My Bump 2 Baby is here to support you. My Bump 2 Baby Business offers training packages, mentorship programs, one-to-one support, and e-courses, if you would like more information on how to grow your business with my bump to baby.

[00:01:19] Then email us. Our email address is

[00:01:35] Hello, and welcome to My Bump 2 Baby Expert podcast, where we bring experts from all over the UK to answer your questions on everything, pregnancy to preschool.

[00:02:01] Today I am joined by Lisa Dawson from Ellison’s solicitors. And, we are talking all about no fault divorce. I hope you enjoy this episode.

[00:02:21] Hello everybody and welcome to My Bump 2 Baby’s Expert podcast. Today, I have special guests, Lisa Dawson from Ellison solicitors with us, and we’re going to be talking about no fault divorce. So hi, Lisa, are you. 

[00:02:36] Lisa: Hello, Carla, I’m fine. How are you? 

[00:02:37] Carla: I’m very well, thank you very well. Um, so could you just introduce yourself, Lisa?

[00:02:43] Lisa: Yeah, sure. I’m a partner, solicitor, uh, Ellison solicitors, and I’m head of the family department. Um, I’ve been at Ellison’s 20 years, this September. So, uh, I did my training contract at Ellison’s and then I qualified into family. So, and then I’ve worked my way up, um, as, as I’ve gone along. Um, and we, we cover everything in family law. So anything you can think of, we do divorce separation, civil partnerships, disillusions, cohabitation agreements, nuptial agreements. We act for grandparents, um, where they want to make applications in respect to their grandchildren. If there’s been a separation. With one of their children, obviously their spouse or partner, and we do internal relocations, international relocation. So really anything you can think of in family law that’s we will probably cover it. 

[00:03:39] Carla: Wow. That is amazing. Yes. Brilliant. So today we’re going to be talking about no fault divorce, because I know there’s a lot of questions around this. Um, so I’m going to start by asking you what a no fault divorce actually is.

[00:03:54] Lisa: Yeah, so no fault divorce. Um, it’s a new divorce that available for everybody prior to no fault divorce, there were five grounds that you had to rely on. So the marriage had to irretrievably broken down and then you had to rely on one of five grounds to proceed with your divorce. So two of those were what was known as the quickie divorce, which was adultery and unreasonable behaviour. And then the others were time-barred. So two years separation by consent and five years separation without consent. And desertion. So the ones we dealt with mainly were unreasonable behaviour and adultery because there were no time limits on when you could make those applications for divorce. But what that meant was is that one party had to take the blame for the breakdown in the marriage now where you’ve got a couple, um, who want to, um, separate amicably that wasn’t ideal at all, because.

[00:04:56] For example in adultery petition, you would be saying that because of that adultery, that’s why your marriage broke down. And that might not actually be the case because it might have been that you’ve been separated for a year, but you’re still married, but because that person’s entered into a new relationship and technically it’s adultery, um, with the unreasonable behaviour, depending on the severity you had to list, sort of between five and seven reasons, examples of behaviours.

[00:05:22] That meant that the court would accept an unreasonable behaviour petition. So from the get go, there was this level of animosity that was being created before you even started to discuss finances on separation, following, um, you know, the marriage breakdown and the children. So the no fault divorce now means that the marriage is irretrievably broken down, but you don’t have to rely on one of those extra grounds is literally what it says on the tin it’s no fault.

[00:05:52] So it’s a, it’s a really positive step forward.

[00:05:55] Carla: Definitely because I imagine that’s, I mean, you could be splitting up on amicable terms, like you said, and then, you know, and then because you want this it’s like, right, what can I, what can I say is the reason why, and then the other person’s like, well, I didn’t know you thought that of me. And, you know, I can imagine it that’s when it gets quite, quite, uh, yeah. Quite messy.

[00:06:17] Lisa: Some, yeah, some people would say, uh, can I list my own unreasonable behaviour? You know, you couldn’t do that. You had to list the other persons on reasonable behaviour. So it did make things difficult from the start really 

[00:06:29] Carla: Yeah it sounds. So when did a no fault divorce become law because that’s only recent, isn’t it? 

[00:06:35] Lisa: Yeah. 6th of April.

[00:06:37] Carla: Wow. 

[00:06:37] Lisa: Yeah, it’s very, very new. Um, there’s been a lot of press attention saying, um, you know, the divorce applications as they’re now called and the highest they’ve been for a long time this month, but that’s because. We’ve had a lot of people waiting. They didn’t want to file a petition on unreasonable behaviour. And once we have the date of the 6th of April, they were waiting for that to come in so that they could rely on no fault to reduce the animosity. Whilst we have fall quite a lot of petitions this month, that the not because suddenly everyone wants to get a divorce it’s because they didn’t want to rely on the previous folk grounds that were available.

[00:07:20] Carla: Yeah. That makes, and that makes a lot of sense. So, so when someone apply for a no fault divorce, then at what stage?

[00:07:29] Lisa: So, and you’re going to be able to apply, in terms of your separation whenever you like really, but you can’t progress a divorce application until you’ve been married for one year and one day.

[00:07:42] Once you’ve been, because we do actually see people that have been married for less than a year, but you can’t follow the divorce application until you’ve got past that point. You should still go and get legal advice because you can enter into a separation agreement. You can still agree arrangements for your children, and you can agree.

[00:07:58] Who’s going to be the applicant on the divorce application for no fault. There’s lots of reasons to still go and get legal advice, but that the time limit is a year in one day that hasn’t changed. 

[00:08:10] Carla: Right. Okay. Okay. And, um, in terms of how long it takes, how long is that? Does it, does it, does it take a long time from application, right the way through to, to the end?

[00:08:22] Lisa: So what it used to be was that you filed your petition with the court, they would then issue your petition and serve it on the response and by post. The respondent then had seven days to reply if they wanted to defend and 14 days, if they weren’t planning to defend, but just to acknowledge service.

[00:08:41] And then as soon as you got your acknowledgement of service, you can, you could then apply for decree nicely. Now, technically you would just then at the court’s mercy as to how long their waiting lists were. And in all honesty, prior to the online divorce service, which we now have access to, it was taking.

[00:09:00] Probably between six to eight months, sometimes longer for the courts to actually deal with an application for decree…. So pre COVID really, it was very bad. Um, but what COVID did was that it forced through the online service quicker. So once that came into play. We then had that available to us to make those applications.

[00:09:24] So actually they would then take in what we would normally say would between four and six months for a petition from beginning to end. But what’s happened now with the no fault because there had to be a compromise in removing the fault element. And the compromise was that they was what is called a cooling off period.

[00:09:43] So what happens now is that you follow your application, your divorce application with the court. They will then send it to the respondents and you have 28 days to serve the divorce application on the respondent. So that’s a slight change. And then the respondent to the application has up to 14 days to reply.

[00:10:05] And then once you’ve got that acknowledgement, that service, then you could apply for what’s called now the conditional order, but you have to wait 20 weeks from the issue of the petition. To be able to do that. So there is that enforced time period is that, as I say, it’s called the cooling off periods.

[00:10:24] So it’s giving couples the opportunity to consider whether they do really want to get divorced. Um, and then the process goes on the same in terms of that you had, once a conditional order is pronounced. You have to wait six weeks and one day to apply for decree absolute. So it, it will. Certainly take longer, but what couples can do in that 20 week periods is use that to discuss their finances, to try and come to an agreement by either going to mediation or using solicitors, either alongside that process or solicitors having discussions or potentially court proceedings as a last resort.

[00:11:07] And in relation to the children. Having those discussions in mediation or between solicitors. So you can have all of those things going along in the background with a view to, with the finances you can file with the court. What’s called a consent order at the point of conditional order being pronounced.

[00:11:29] The only problem, really in respect of that time to. Is that normally we would always say to people, don’t implement your financial agreement until you have a consent or to seal by the court now, because we can’t follow that until condition at all. And then you’re going to have to wait for that to be considered and sealed by the court that is going to cause a delay.

[00:11:55] So if what sometimes happens, people come to us or, you know, a wife or a husband will come from. And say, look, we’re, we’re really amicable. We’re going to do the no fault divorce and we’ve sorted out the finances and we just want to get on with it. They’re going to have a problem in that they might need to look at alternatives like a separation agreement in the interim periods.

[00:12:18] They’ll need to consider whether they should implement it because sometimes an agreement will be reached that might not necessarily be approved by the court. So there is that issue. In terms of the time that it will take because the divorce application won’t receive a final order. I suspect you will be advised not to seek a final order until the finances have been resolved so that that’s an added complication that you need to consider along with your solicitor about how to move things forward.

[00:12:52] Carla: I, I totally get that. I liked what you said about all the things going on in the background. So you do feel like you are progressing with, you know, everything while that’s happening, because there is a lot to sort, especially when you’ve got children. Um, so there’s all the child arrangements. And then, like you said, the finances, if a house is to get sold, et cetera. So there’s a lot to consider isn’t there?

[00:13:14] Lisa: Yeah. And it gives you that 20 weeks. It sounds like a really long time. And actually, and if you add on how long it actually takes for the court to list it and then pronounce it, you’re probably looking at six months in total. And that sounds like a really long time, but actually it gives both parties time to reflect, to come to terms with, you know, the breakdown in the marriage to see whether arrangements have agreed work, to put the house on the market. And then if it sells, you can. Look again at the financial agreement that has been reached. So it’s not, it’s not necessarily bad news. It’s just something. Perhaps we haven’t needed to consider before. 

[00:13:52] Carla: Yeah. Yeah. And there’s like you said, there’s a lot, lot to consider because I suppose with your finances as well, you could end up agreeing something and the house actually goes for a lot less than, or more than what you thought. Or, and then again, you have to look at those again. So there’s a lot of things that can happen along the way, really. Um, and then also. Perhaps someone met someone along the line as well. You just don’t know. So, yeah.

[00:14:16] Lisa: So there is, I think, you know, that six months goes, it does go very quickly. And I think, you know, divorce, I often say is a bit like a death. You have to come to terms with it and you go through all the emotions and that six months we’ll give you. Time to, to heal to an extent and reflect and take advice and consider all the finances and get financial disclosure from your spouse so that you can. Properly consider what agreement should be put in place.

[00:14:48] Carla: Um, yeah, so, so Lisa, just, um, another question that sprung to mind actually is, you know, if someone applies for the no fault divorce and then the other person doesn’t want that, what, what would be the process then? Sorry to over-complicate it just, just in case someone might think they want that and then change the mind.

[00:15:10] Lisa: So there is in, in terms of the new procedure, there is a new way of going ahead with it, which is a joint application. So both parties can apply for a divorce application. So that’s, that’s completely new. What is also completely new is that you cannot defend a divorce petition. So if the respondent doesn’t want to get divorced. That’s not a reason to delay the petition. So it might have been historically that someone would defend an unreasonable behavior petition. We, we used to work in a way that would try and limit the circumstances that would happen, but now they can, there are very limited circumstances where they can. And they are quite legal technical issues in terms of jurisdiction and whether the marriage was even violated.

[00:16:03] So they’re very, very narrow and technically complicated, but you cannot now just simply defend a divorce. So again, that removes an element where you’ve got, for example, a controlling partner who. Simply doesn’t want to let the marriage go. They will not be able to complicate that they will be able to complicate it in terms of you might need to seek additional.

[00:16:28] In relation to service of the petition, but once you are the application, but once you get to that point, then you will be able to progress your divorce and they won’t be able to stop it, which is a good thing. 

[00:16:39] Carla: Yeah, it is. It really is because, I mean, I was going to actually ask him if that if a non fault divorce means that people won’t be able to rely on domestic abuse in the process of the divorce. How does that work? 

[00:16:53] Lisa: Yeah. So what used to happen with the unreasonable behaviour? We used to try and do it on the basis that they were as mild validations as possible, um, in order to minimise the acrimony between the parties, but often people will feel like they need to vent those allegations. And often it will be the case that they want to raise the allegations of abuse because they are relevant, uh, within children up proceedings, for example, where there has been abuse that would potentially have an impact on what the court would order in relation to the time that the absent parent spends with the child.

[00:17:31] So. Those domestic abuse allegations can be raised if relevant in financial proceedings, which are very limited and they’re probably a whole other podcast, but, um, we, and in children act proceedings where they would be potentially raised and considered and, and just because they haven’t, or there isn’t the ability now to raise them in a new.

[00:17:54] Um, application that doesn’t mean that they can’t be raised later, which is really important for people to understand actually that whilst the no fault divorce is a positive from that perspective. It releases an element of control, as I’ve said before with the other party. But it doesn’t mean that because you’re accepting a no fault divorce, which is actually now the only option available that you cannot raise concerns of domestic abuse within other proceedings.

[00:18:23] Carla: That’s really interesting because sometimes, um, you know, some, some parents might only realize afterwards that they were involved in an abusive relationship because some, sometimes there’s a lot of different forms of abuse and there’s, you know, there’s been a lot of TV programs about. Abuse, um, and in different ways because there’s financial, sorry. I know it is totally another subject, but there is financial, controlling behaviour and it doesn’t always mean, um, you know, physical abuse. Um, there’s, there’s, there’s a lot of different, different types of abuse out there. And sometimes all it is, is listening to someone else or talking to someone else and you think, oh my goodness, I was, that was, that was my partner. So, so it was interesting that, that. 

[00:19:08] Lisa: Absolutely. Yeah. It’s only often when there is a breakdown of the marriage and one or relationship even where one party then finally speaks to someone or speaks to a solicitor. All speaks to a women’s aid or other domestic abuse organisations, um, which deal with, um, violence against men as well. Um, where they realize that, oh, oh actually, yes, that, that is what happened to me and that they do, you know, they do realize cause when you’re in a domestic abusive relationship, your level of tolerance, um, gets higher and higher because the abuse increases. So you don’t necessarily see it until you’re out of it. So it’s still very important to get advice, even if you’re going for a no fault divorce.

[00:19:55] So a lot of people will now, um, as I did before, to be honest, with the online service, they will do the petition or application themselves. Um, but that doesn’t mean that you shouldn’t, you know, knowledge is power, I think, with these situations and you should always at least get provisional preliminary advice where you are contemplating filing a no-fault petition or application. Sorry that the applications just come in, all the wording has changed to make it more friendly, so its only been in 13 days.

[00:20:27] Carla: Oh yes after 20 years in the field. It’s a lot to learn, a big change.

[00:20:35] Lisa: It is. But it’s, you know, there are, there are some negatives to it to a degree, but I think imbalance is a positive change and it will, um, it will certainly have a positive impact on couples. Amicably divorcing because it does happen. And it happens all the time. And that will certainly be of benefit to those families because they’re now blended families.

[00:21:01] They’re going to be in each other’s lives forever. They will have children potentially of other people, and you’ve got step parents and, you know, it’s really important to try and maintain the amicable relationship and the fault based divorce didn’t help that. Whereas now, couples. Actually, I don’t have to raise that with them. I don’t have to rely on that so I can proceed with the divorce and then save your energy for discussions over the finances in children. 

[00:21:30] Carla: Yeah. That’s huge. A huge, huge change. But yeah, I totally see what you’re saying. I think it’s a positive, positive move forward. So, um, Lisa, is there anything else that you think is important to add here?

[00:21:43] Lisa: I think really, I would just say to people that. Um, as I’ve just said, the risk of repeating myself is that it is important to still get advice because you can proceed with the no fault divorce. And we would always discuss with people doing it themselves. You know, you’re not obligated to instruct solicitors to do it.

[00:22:01] But what I would say is that part of that that’s important. Is getting advice about the financial situation because. Even when you get a final order for a divorce, if you haven’t got consent order in place that does not prevent claims being raised later. So if you divorce and you’ve got your final order. And then you come into a large inheritance. Your ex spouse can then make a financial application to the court. Now it might not be that they would get any share of it, but there is a litigation risk there that they could raise. Whereas if you got your agreement put into a consent order that contains a clean break, then that would prevent that from happening in the future.

[00:22:49] So it’s important to. At least get that provision at advice to understand the impact of decisions and agreements that you’re coming to. And in relation to your children, because issues will, will always come up and often people will search on Google and it might be if you’re looking at a solicitor’s website, that has got good information on it, on it, but there are some websites that do not have good information on a bit like, you know, Dr. Google doctor will say to you, don’t Google your symptoms. It’s the same with, with your legal situation, you should go and see a qualified sister, preferably one who’s a member of resolution.

[00:23:30] Most family solicitors are members of resolution, which is a national agency, which is dedicated to proceeding with the breakdown of relationships in a non-confrontational amicable way. So you can go on to resolution and find a solicitor who is a member to help ensure that you proceed with your separation in that way.

[00:23:52] Or also get a referral from a friend or friends of a friend. If it’s somebody who’s been to see someone. And do your research really into who you’re going to see, but it’s just really important to get advice for the no fault. Yes it makes divorce easier on the face of it, but that doesn’t take away the complexities of the finances and the children aspects, which as I say, it’s just really important to get that proper advice so that you’re fully informed when making those decisions.

[00:24:22] Carla: Absolutely. I was nodding away then when you said Dr. Google, cause I had a headache the other day, I Googled it. Now I should be dead right now. So I totally agree with you. I mean, for, for, I think in terms of, you know, divorcing you on everything to be absolutely right. And anything can turn at any point, you know, six months it could take up to six months is a long time for someone to meet someone else, you to meet someone else and want to get a bit angry or, you know, Can change. And I do think it’s really important to, to work with, with your local solicitor, where you can ring them up and say, right, this has happened. And you’ve got the right advice there because it’s easy to fill in an application, but you don’t really know, you know, you want to know the ins and outs really.

[00:25:07] Lisa: Yeah. And also people will, um, perhaps be wary of going to a family sister because they’ll advise you to, you know, go for the jugular. And it’s, it’s just not like that, right. It certainly shouldn’t be, um, so if you go to resolution and find a solicitor on there, or go by recommendation of someone you should, your solicitor should be discussing with you options of mediation. For example, arbitration they’re all family focused resolution options available to people to come to an agreement and not go through the courts. And so that’s something that your solicitor should be discussing with you. 

[00:25:42] Carla: Yeah. That’s brilliant. I’m glad you mentioned about resolution because I liked the sound of that and keeping it amicable really. I think, you know, as much as possible. Um, it is great. So, so, um, Lisa, can you just tell everyone where they can find you if they want more information about this? No fault divorce and, and if they don’t kind of work with Ellison solicitors. 

[00:26:04] Lisa: Course. So we have branches throughout East Anglea. And, but we also, obviously, since COVID carry out appointments virtually, so even if you’re not local to us, we could do a telephone or video appointment as well.

[00:26:17] But Ellison’s, um, we’ve been established for over 250 years now. So we’ve grown. So when I started, we had probably about 70 staff and now we’re thinking. Coming up to 250, maybe over 250. So we’ve grown substantially over the years. So we have lots of different departments. So we, so when we work with a client in particular, we will identify if they need to make a new will, for example, or we’ll be able to refer them to our residential department, if they need help with selling their house. And if they have commercial properties, We have a commercial property department. We have an employment department in solvency dispute resolution. So we’re able to give a client that holistic approach by working internally in our firm and hand them over to the right person and recognise when they need different aspects of the law to assess.

[00:27:12] Carla: That’s brilliant because it’s like, when you’re selling a house, isn’t it. And you’re trying to, you know, you ring in all these different people, but you know, to have it all under one roof is brilliant. Everyone knows what’s going on. So that that’s really good. Um, so Lisa, could you tell us where, um, what numbers they need to contact on how they can get hold of you?

[00:27:32] Lisa: Of course. Yeah. So you can either go to the Ellison Solicitors website and link in through the contact page, or you could call the main number on 01206 764477. And you can either ask for me Lisa Dawson, or you could speak to any one of the team. That’d be more than willing to help you.

[00:27:50] And the other option is to email me. So it’s Lisa L I S a dot Dawson, D a w S O N Ellison’s solicitors. So it’s two S’s in the middle dot com.

[00:28:01] Carla: That’s brilliant. Thank you very much, Lisa. That’s that’s been so useful. I really, really appreciate you coming on today. 

[00:28:09] Lisa: That’s no problem. It’s lovely to talk to you.

[00:28:11] Carla: Thank you.

[00:28:13] Thank you for listening to My Bump 2 Baby’s Expert podcast. If you would like to find help and support from experts in your local area, head over to and you will also be able to find local pregnancy to preschool groups, classes, businesses, and services in your local area.

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Why Every Parent Needs Income Protection. Tue, 29 Mar 2022 16:01:27 +0000 In today’s expert podcast we speak with Jordan Shekoni about Income Protection, what it is and why you should have it. We discuss what income protection actually is, how it works, what you are covered for plus so much more.

The post Why Every Parent Needs Income Protection. appeared first on MyBump2Baby Podcasts.

  • Why Every Parent Needs Income Protection.

In today’s expert podcast we speak with Jordan Shekoni about Income Protection, what it is and why you should have it. We discuss what income protection actually is, how it works, what you are covered for plus so much more.

More Than Money links:

Contact number : 01233555454

Email : 


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[00:01:35] Hello, and welcome to My Bump 2 Baby expert podcast, where we bring experts from all over the UK to answer your questions on everything, pregnancy to preschool.

[00:02:00] Today. I am joined by senior protection advisor, Jordan from More Than Money. And today we are going to be talking all about income protection, what it is and how it can help your family. I hope you enjoy this episode.

[00:02:21] Hello everybody. And welcome to My Bump 2 Baby’s Expert podcast. Today, I am joined by Jordan from More Than Money an independent advisory firm. And today we’re going to be talking about the also important income protection. So hello, Jordan, how are you? 

[00:02:39] Jordan: I’m very well thank you, very well, yourself?. 

[00:02:41] Carla: Yes. I’m very well, thank you. I’m really happy to have you guys on here talking about this subject. It’s so important. So we’ll dive straight into the questions, Jordan. And can you tell us a little bit about what income protection is? 

[00:02:55] Jordan: Okay. Yeah, of course, of course. So income protection is, um, very similar to having sick pay for your employer, um, where if you cannot work due to any illness or any accident we can ensure that provider or insurance company pays you a monthly wage or monthly benefit. Until you are healthy enough to return back into work. 

[00:03:14] Carla: That’s brilliant. So it really does protect families because obviously when, when it comes to families, there’s, there’s a lot of bills to pay. Isn’t there, you know, there’s nursery fees, mortgages, rent, you know, and if you can’t work, you know, if you’ve, if you’ve not got that protection, it’s obviously it’s obviously going to be a real struggle.

[00:03:33] So, so that’s it, so, so can you tell us a little bit more about how income protection actually works? 

[00:03:41] Jordan: Yeah, of course. So for example, for a lot of people, um, your company may cover you with a little bit of sick pay for a few weeks, or maybe a few months, if you’re lucky you work for the NHS and you get , maybe up to six months to a year.

[00:03:56] Um, but for those who only have it for a short period of time or no sick pay at all, um, if you’re off work due to a sickness or due to an accident, you’re not going to have any income coming in. So it’s very important that you have something that’s going to support your monthly, help you cover your bills, help you get your food shopping, help you look after your family.

[00:04:15] And it’s literally just as simple as giving the insurance company a call saying, hi i’m sick. What, they will say is, okay. We just need a doctor’s note just to essentially prove that you’re off work due to the illness. Once you’ve done that, then the insurance company will start paying your claim monthly until you’re back at work.

[00:04:31] So really, really simple stuff, pays a monthly benefit just to ensure that you’re able to keep head above water or live comfortably. And when you’re back at work, um, insurance stops paying the monthly premiums. And then you’ll just go back to, um, back to work as normal. 

[00:04:46] Carla: Right. That’s really good. I’m guessing, obviously you’re covered with that, it’s income protection. So you’re covered for, is it just sickness? Is it that it would cover?

[00:04:56] Jordan: So as any type of sickness and any type of accidents, it’s also anything else related to, so if you’re, anything that stops you from getting up for work in the morning, it could be a broken bone. It could be a chest infection, could be an illness, could be quite severe.

[00:05:09] If you’re bedridden, for example, anything that prevents you from getting up and doing your job that day, you can claim on your income protection plan to get some financial support. 

[00:05:20] Carla: Wow. Right. Okay. That’s brilliant. So, so how long are you covered for? So if you were off work for quite a long time, how long would that protection last?

[00:05:30] Jordan: So you have a few options on that basis. So you can have up to a years cover. You can have up to two years, cover some insurance will cover you up to five years. If you’re off work for that period of time. And some insurers or most insurers will pretty much cover you up, into retirement age. So, you can pretty much choose how long you cover it for. So it’s pretty good. 

[00:05:51] Carla: Oh, that’s good. So it’s really flexible as well. And I imagine as your circumstances change, you know, you can, you can kind of work it in with that. Can’t you really? So how many times could someone use it or, or claim on this insurance? 

[00:06:07] Jordan: You can use it unlimited times. So, um, yeah, so you can literally claim on it, as many times as you need to. Um, there’s no limit on that. So it just means that if you need to claim once a year, for example, twice a year, five times a year, a hundred times during the policy term up until you’re retired, you can do that. It’s unlimited. 

[00:06:28] Carla: So if you’re a very sick person, I mean, I’ve got a friend that breaks a lot of bones actually, and she’s just one of these really unfortunate people that ends up in a lot of accidents or ill health. And to be honest, this would be, would be perfect for her really. But I mean, I mean, I mean, it’s just that reassurance that, you know, you’re covered because a lot of people do look at life insurance don’t they, and stuff like that. And that’s worst case scenario obviously it’s very, very important, but you are probably more likely to, to be off ill, aren’t you, you’re more likely to be off work ill so. 

[00:07:02] Jordan: Exactly. You’re actually up to 10 times more likely to fall sick before passing away. So you’re much more likely to be off work due to illness and actually pass away based on statistics. So it’s actually probably more important to have income protection depending on your circumstances for then some people who have life cover.

[00:07:20] Carla: Yeah, that makes sense. And what we’ll do is obviously I know you cover a couple of the other areas. We’ll just touch on all the things that you guys do afterwards. Cause I think when, when parents think of life insurance or family protection, they just think, well, if I die and for some people, they don’t want to think about that. And then they stop getting that extra life insurance, but there’s a lot of other kind of protections out there that will protect you and your family should the worst happen. That’s not a nice thought, is it? But, um, you know, you just think. You know, you wouldn’t want your family to be without anything. And as certainly, if you’re ill, what can happen? You know, we’ve only seen, we’ve only just come, well, we’re not even out of COVID yet, but we’ve seen how ill people can actually get and for how long it’s it’s had them ill fe for. So, so I think, um, income protection is, is probably, you know, high, high demand at the moment. So if. I own a business and something happened to me. What would actually happen to my business? 

[00:08:19] Jordan: So you have, you have two options now. Um, if you are the director of the business and you have employees. Um, but you make a financial contribution to your business and you cannot work. The first thing we’d asked you is what type of impact will that have in your business? So if it means that you can’t pay your employees, for example, or you having issues with the time that you’re having off, because that’s affecting the income in the business, then we can get you get the insurance company to pay your business rather than yourself. So at least that way you can make sure that your employees are paid. You can make sure that you’re still paid for your business. And again, once you’re back at work, everything’s back to normal hopefully. 

[00:08:59] Carla: That’s, that’s really good. So that’s like a business income protection is it policy?

[00:09:03] Jordan: Exactly.

[00:09:04] Carla: Yeah. Right. Okay. And, and, um, how much can I get from the insurer if I can’t work? 

[00:09:13] Jordan: So it really depends upon how much you earn. So most providers would pay up to about 60 some may go up to the 65% of your total annual income. And the reason why they cap it there is because most of the time when your income naturally, or everybody would pay tax on their income. So you’re probably not going to see about 20, 25 or 30% of your income. So the insurance try to get it as close to you as your take home as possible. 

[00:09:42] Carla: That makes sense. Right. Okay. That’s great. And so will any insurer cover me? Have you got a choice of insurers you can use or? 

[00:09:52] Jordan: You, you do to a degree now, if you’re in, if you’re in good health, then most insurers will be happy to insure you as normal. And then of course it will be up to you to pick which insurer you prefer, but if you have any, any illnesses or maybe your occupation might be particularly hazardous, for example. Then there might be one insurer who’s going to be better for you than another, because you may get a lower price. So they may provide you with better coverage for what you do in your day to day.

[00:10:19] Carla: That’s brilliant. And if I wanted to get that for my partner or someone wants you to get that for the partner, or maybe even they have children at home, is that possible? Can you get it for the whole family? 

[00:10:30] Jordan: So you can get income protection for anybody above the age of 18 who earns an income. If they’re below 18, then of course we can’t cover their income because they don’t have one potentially. Yeah. If you, if you want to get income protections for yourself, for your partner, it really depends again, who is the main bread winner in the situation. If it’s both of you, then I’d recommend both you get it. Whereas if one of you definitely earned most of the income, and if they’re off work due to sickness, then what type of impact is that going to have on your on your household? So yeah, in short you can get it for your partner.

[00:11:04] Carla: No, that, that makes sense. So, so how much does income protection costs then? 

[00:11:10] Jordan: So income protection, the premiums, the monthly price that reflect your occupation and your age, essentially. So the younger you are, the lower the price would be because again, based on statistics, you’re likely to be fit and healthier. The younger you are. And if your occupation is quite risk adverse, if you work in an office for example, then your premiums will be lower. Whereas if you worked on a construction site, you may be paying a little bit more for your cover just based on the risk of you actually claiming on the plan. So it’s all dependent upon the individual and their health, their age and what they do for work.

[00:11:49] Carla: That makes sense. I mean, and, and on My Bump 2 Baby, we’re really passionate about, um, linking growing families with their local advisors, because a lot of people make the mistake of going online and just taking out insurance, not reading the small print, just going, right that’s the cheapest I’ll go for that. And unfortunately, a lot of people have found that, that they’re not actually covered when it comes to claiming. So I think working with you guys, um, it’s, it’s really important that people actually speak to people who know. Who are in the job and actually know what they’re talking about and can check that small print for you. Really?

[00:12:24] Jordan: Yes, absolutely. Actually I think even whilst we’re here, just to say. I would always recommend anybody who’s looking at insurance, try and speak to a qualified advisor. Somebody who is licensed or has the qualifications to give you advice. That’s the best place to start, because if anything goes wrong, you know that you’re either speaking with somebody who’s qualified to give you that advice. They’re going to give you the right thing or at least you have some backup from the FCA or S E S T 

[00:12:53] Carla: That’s brilliant. Um, so what do you look at parents, growing families that already have income protection and their circumstances may have changed, or they may have taken out policies a few years ago, and they’re not really sure if what they’ve got is actually good for them at this moment in time.

[00:13:11] Jordan: Yes. So, on that basis, we do offer something called free reviews. So every two to four years, if you’re an existing client or new clients who are looking at new policies or different types of products, we’ll always look at your existing plan to see whether it still suits your needs. And it’s important to do that because things do change.

[00:13:29] You may have another child, you may change your occupation. You may be able to save some money. If your job is less risky, for example. So always good to review a plan. Make sure it’s suitable for your needs, at all points in time, because things change throughout life. And we just want to make sure that your, your best protected at all point in times.

[00:13:46] Carla: Yeah, that’s, that’s really important. And I have known people that have actually been paying into life policies and policies like income protection, and they’ve gone to review it. And actually it’s a lot cheaper than what they originally paid out. So it’s definitely worth doing, um, not just obviously you don’t want it, cheaper doesn’t always mean better, but at the same time, it, you know, you want to, you want, you don’t want to pay the cheapest and actually not be covering yourself. I think that’s the mistake. A lot of people do. And you may as well not be paying anything at all then do you know what I mean? 

[00:14:18] Jordan: Yeah, exactly. In this, um, we call it the, the sweet spot where it provides you with the right type of cover but at the right price. Sometimes it’s hard to do it because again, it really depends upon your circumstances, your health, your age, mainly. Um, but again, cheap is not always best. So it’s important that you have a plan that is suitable for your needs, that you know, is going to either provide you with the right type of income or the right type of protection.

[00:14:44] Carla: That’s brilliant. And can you tell me Jordan, the difference between this and critical income, critical illness sorry cover is it, is it quite, quite similar? 

[00:14:55] Jordan: There’s a few crossovers, but they are very different. So with critical illness cover, you be covered for a list of conditions. So let’s say for example, most insurers will cover you for a minimum of between 40 and 50 different critical illness conditions. Um, for most common conditions will be things like cancers, heart attacks, strokes, and multiple sclerosis. And then of course you’re covered for a variety of other conditions. Now, the chances of you getting any conditions on the list. For the main ones is quite high. You know, you could be looking at up to up to 50% chance of you getting one of the main conditions, but with you getting one of the other conditions, the risk would be a little bit lower. Now, if you were to get one of the conditions that are listed on the policy, then you will receive a payout from the insurer and that’s it.

[00:15:42] You receive one pay on the critical illness plan and you are no longer covered.

[00:15:46] Carla: So like a lump sum.

[00:15:48] Jordan: Yeah, exactly. Like a lump sum. You would get a lump sum payout. Let’s say your mortgage is a hundred thousand. You get a form of cancer. For example, that’s on the list. Then you receive a hundred thousand to cover the mortgage and that’s it. Whereas income protection, it covers you for anything that stops you from working. So it could be minor. It could be major, it could be serious, it could be quite mild, but if it prevents you from working, then the insurer will give you that monthly income until you can return to work. 

[00:16:17] Carla: Yeah. So the income protection side of things, then, I mean that, that is. I suppose if you’ve got something like cancer, um, you know, and your, you were unable to work for quite quite a few years and you have the longer policy that it’s going to pay your bills each month, isn’t it really. 

[00:16:34] Jordan: Exactly. Yeah, exactly. I mean, it’s, um, it’s good to have critical illness cover. I recommend both because it can, it just covers you in the event of something happening, but, um, you know, a payout can only go so far. Bill’s never stop. So even if your mortgage is paid off, you still have to pay for food shopping monthly. You still need to pay for the utilities you wifi, you know, things that leisure entertainment. So that’s where income protection comes in. Even if the mortgage is paid for you still get the income to cover everything else.

[00:17:05] Carla: That’s brilliant. Especially with these electricity prices going up, uh, you know, thats what, you know, it’s very expensive. So you want your children to also have the same life as what they’ve had before, because not only do you, you know, if you’re really ill, you know, a, you know, it’s sad cause mommy, or daddy’s really ill, but you know, if you have to stop swimming lessons for them, if you had to stop them from doing their usual activities, it’s like its everything that goes, isn’t it really? So. It’s so important. No that’s really, really great. And you’ve answered all of the questions that I had, but I’d love to hear a bit more about More Than Money and how you guys can help growing families if that’s okay? 

[00:17:47] Jordan: Yeah, of course. So More Than Money, we’re a young team. It’s really important that I, um, I mean age is nothing but a number of course, but a reason why I emphasise on young it’s because it’s more of a, it’s more of a mind frame rather than the actual age. So we were very young. We’re very vibrant. And for us, it’s really important to have a real conversation with individuals. I think the whole perception on insurance unfortunately, isn’t great, isn’t great. A lot of people concerned whether insurers actually will pay out. Can we actually trust, insurances and insurance companies. Can we actually trust insurance policies? Whereas when you speak to somebody like ourselves, um, we are really for the people, um, what i’d like to say, is that, although we work with the insurer, we actually work for the people so we give you free advice to start with. Which is, uh, which is a massive bonus. So rather than potentially going to a bank, who may charge you an extra premium just for giving me advice. We’re absolutely free. And it is optional. We’re actually not allowed to push you anywhere. So you can feel confident that you can have an open conversation. We’re not going to force you to take up a cover, but we are going to ensure that we give you the right type of advice for your circumstances. Um, we cover income protection of course, we cover life insurance uh, critical illness cover, family income benefits, which is similar to income protection, but that is more of a case of if somebody passes away in the family. Um, would you still need an income if the answer is yes, they we will ensure you receive x amount per month for a set number of years up until let’s say you’re retired or up until the kids are independent.

[00:19:24] So you no longer have to worry about how you’re going to cover, you know, things that food shopping, if that’s what your partner covers. Usually when they were around. So we, we offer a wide range of products. The most important thing to us really is, is having a good conversation with many different people. Because at the end of the day, we, we are also people as well. We also human beings. We have families ourselves. We have commitments ourselves. We understand how important it is for us to make sure these are covered in the event that anything should happen, but it’s also important that we have the best type of products for ourselves.

[00:19:57] And we would do the same for, for our families. So why not do the same for somebody on the street? I mean, the end of the day, it could be a family, you know, distant relative. You never know. 

[00:20:07] Carla: So, you know, you’re so right. I th I think, I think the thing is, um, uh, when I, I used to work in financial service, I used to working in banking and actually the amount of people that we saw that came in and they come in and they say, oh, did we, did we take out that insurance, that time you spoke to us about it? Cause years ago you used to be able to talk to them and they hadn’t and seeing they’re just, oh gosh, just seeing, oh, there was one woman in particular.

[00:20:35] And, um, she, she actually didn’t take out the insurance. She really wanted too, her husband. In fact, he wasn’t a husband at the time. It was her partner at the time he was still married to his ex partner. So it was a bit of a messy situation. Um, in terms of, you know, in terms of who would get what, but basically he passed away and they had a daughter together and she was saying to him, please get this insurance, please get this insurance.

[00:21:00] And he said, oh, I’ll have a look it and I’ll sort it out. And he never did. And I remember she lost, she lost everything because the house that they lived in, because he was still married, it was actually, it’s obviously there’s a lot more to it, but the ex partner came and took the house. So this lady was left basically homeless with her daughter. Um, and all, because all because she didn’t take out insurance, so there’s so many different scenarios I’ve seen as well. Um, and I bet for you, um, Jordan it’s actually, although you never want anyone to have to claim on these things, I bet it’s rewarding seeing people actually make the claims and them being successful and knowing that you’ve actually helped that person.

[00:21:43] Jordan: Yeah. Exactly we try, as you know, we offer reviews every two to four years. So we do actually develop a really good relationship with our clients anyway. So when the worst has happened, it is, it is a bit sad for us to, but people do send those letters and send those card, sometimes send us gifts just as a thank you to say look you protected our family financially, the worst has happened. We can’t replace the individual, but you’ve made sure that we can keep our house. You’ve made sure that we can still keep our kids in school. We can keep clothes, clothes on their backs, food on the table, things like that. So, you know, as much as it is really, really sad, we, we do, we do find it rewarding when we do have a successful claim paid, because you can just see the importance of, of having the protection in the first place.

[00:22:26] So a hundred percent. And even while we’re here, Um, there is something you can do called life of another. Where you can actually insure your partner. So you can take on a plan. You can speak to the insurer. I would probably say speak to us because we can give good advice. But essentially what you can do is you can set the policy up on behalf of your partner, but you do need their consent. And depending upon the provider, the individual themselves would need to complete the health questions in relation to the actual application form. But apart from that. If you want to, you can pay for the policy. You can take charge of it. You can make sure its all in place that way, if your partner isn’t as serious as you’d like them to be, at least, you know, you got the peace of mind, you’ve got it all set up.

[00:23:11] Um, you’ve just taken five, 10 minutes out of their day just to get them on a phone, just to complete the application, and then they can continue on doing what they’re doing, but you can have that peace of mind then, um, that product isn’t spoken about much. Um, but again, really important of course, getting the consent of the individual that you want to insure. But once you’ve done that, um, at least, you know, that you you’ve done the hard work and that God forbid if the worst should happen you’ve got that protection in place.

[00:23:36] Carla: Wow. I didn’t know that about that Jordan, but I think that makes a massive difference because I think sometimes in a relationship there’s one person that like looks after the, the money side of things, not all the time. And then, um, one person that, you know, sees this and thinks, oh my goodness, if this happened, that would happen. And it’s not always an agreement in, in the life insurance. And because you have to have a conversation about it, obviously you still would in this scenario, but you’d have to, you think, oh, I’ll have to sit down with someone, i’ll have to do this.

[00:24:05] I mean, the fact that one of the people could actually put the wheels in motion and actually get that done. It is massive. I think if it, if it was actually the other way, round insurance, so naturally you were paying, so if your partner died, you know, you’d be covered. I think a lot more people would take it out because, because you’ve just got to think on, you know, instead of even thinking about yourselves really, think about your partner today and, and what, what you’d miss out on. Even, even with mums, you know, I mean, I could never be a full-time stay-at-home mum. I think it’s probably the hardest job in the world, but even, even as a dad listening to this, that he’s got a wife that stays at home. And perhaps doesn’t bring in an income, think of all the jobs that she does, that you would have to still work and you’d still have to do all those jobs, cleaning, cooking, you know, all of those you’d probably need help. And if you’ve not got any more income coming in, then you know, what, what would you do? Um, so from both sides, really? So. 

[00:25:08] Jordan: Yeah, no, no, exactly. You hit the nail on the head there and. It’s it’s, it’s always sad, uh, uh, you shouldn’t get emotional over your work. And, um, I do try not to, but again, you know, I’m human. I speak to humans as well, so I can, I can really relate to a lot of the sad stories that we do come across. So always best to get your insurance sorted as soon as possible. It’s cheaper because you’re going to be younger and you’re always going to get older. So it’s not as if you’re going to make a saving if you leave it for a couple of years. You just might as well get it done now.

[00:25:39] Carla: Yeah, exactly. If you put it off too long, the price has gone up. So, so you may as well get it done today really. So Jordan, how can people get in touch with you, um, to kind of find out a bit more or get you to review their policies? 

[00:25:53] Jordan: Yeah, so it’s, um, it’s really so simple theres a few options. Um, you can give us a call on our main office number, you can ask for myself, or you can speak to one of the advisors who are available. Um, the number would be 01233555454. So that’s zero one, two three triple five, four or five, four. So that’s the, the main office number?.

[00:26:20] Um, email address pretty simple. You can, you can email me at You can pretty much just send me an email saying hi Jordan, I’d like some advice and we’ll start there really simple.

[00:26:32] So 

[00:26:37] And lastly, we do have a special link that you can click. It’s actually a relation to this podcast from, bump to baby. So, um, if you, if you follow this link, which is https://

[00:26:54] so the, the normal thing and you click in via the web link. You know what I mean? If you type in morethanmoneyUK/contact-more-than-money/. So contact more than money with hyphens in between forward slash, and that will take you straight to our landing page and you do get a special discount for following that link.

[00:27:16] But if it’s easier give me a call, give me an email and we will also arrange special rates for you. 

[00:27:22] Carla: That’s that’s brilliant. And what we’ll do is we’ll put all of those contact details on the bottom of this podcast. So if anyone clicks onto the description, there’ll be able to click straight through to the phone number, et cetera, and the web link.

[00:27:35] So thank you so much, Jordan. You’ve been a delight. You’ve answered all of my questions. Um, That’s brilliant. It’s been really helpful. Thank you so much. 

[00:27:45] Jordan: That alright I’ve enjoyed this as well. Thank you for having myself and I mean, essentially you’ve had the team here, so, um, thank you for having us. Um, it’s a pleasure speaking i’ve really enjoyed it and, um, I hope we speak again soon.

[00:27:58] Thank you for listening to My Bump 2 Baby’s Expert podcast. If you would like to find help and support from experts in your local area, head over to and you will also be able to find local pregnancy to preschool groups, classes, businesses, and services in your local area.

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Everything you need to know about Prenuptial Agreements Thu, 27 Jan 2022 14:51:53 +0000 In today’s podcast Carla Lett speaks with Eve Geere Senior Associate for Parfitt Cresswell. Eve answers and discusses all your questions about prenuptial agreements including postnuptial agreements too and the reason people should consider them.

The post Everything you need to know about Prenuptial Agreements appeared first on MyBump2Baby Podcasts.

  • Everything you need to know about Prenuptial Agreements

In today’s podcast Carla Lett speaks with Eve Geere Senior Associate for Parfitt Cresswell. 

Eve answers and discusses all your questions about prenuptial agreements including postnuptial agreements too and the reason people should consider them.

They discuss about what a prenup actually is, what can be covered in a prenup, why people use them, why it is important to seek legal advice plus so much more.


Article on Pre-Nuptial Agreements:

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[00:01:35] Hello, and welcome to My Bump 2 Baby’s Expert podcast, where we bring experts from all over the UK to answer your questions on everything, pregnancy to preschool.

[00:01:58] Today, we are talking all about prenuptial agreements. Today I am joined by Eve Geere, a senior associate from Parfitt Cresswell, and she is going to be sharing her knowledge with us on prenuptial agreements. And hopefully she answers all your questions.

[00:02:21] Hello everybody. And welcome to My Bump 2 Baby’s Expert podcast. Today, we are talking all about prenuptial agreements and I am joined by the lovely Eve Geere, a senior associate from Parfitt Cresswell. How are you doing? 

[00:02:36] Eve: I’m well, thank you. 

[00:02:38] Carla: Good. I’m very excited to speak to about this subject because I imagine it’s a bit of a mind field for some people.

[00:02:45] Eve: It certainly can be. Yes. 

[00:02:47] Carla: So Eve, can you just tell us a little bit more about you when and what you do for Parfitt Cresswell? 

[00:02:53] Eve: Yeah, certainly. So I am a solicitor in the family department. I’m a senior associate, so I conduct work in the family field exclusively. So it’s really anything associated with the family home. I advise clients on divorce and separation. Any children matters, parties that aren’t married or in a civil partnership, but perhaps living together. So co-habitation issues and also I assist clients in relation to injunctions. So if there is any domestic abuse situations, I can assist clients applying to the court to get the protection that they need.

[00:03:38] Carla: Oh, that’s fantastic. That’s fantastic. Cause I know there’s a lot of talk around domestic abuse at the moment and the different aspects of it. I know there’s um, it’s not just kind of physical is it? There’s a lot of different, different options, but I, I suppose that will be saved for another podcast that we can talk about.

[00:03:57] So today, we are going to touch on a prenuptial agreements. So can you just tell us a little bit more about what a prenuptial agreement actually is? 

[00:04:05] Eve: Yes. So put very simply a prenuptial agreement, an agreement entered into by two parties ahead of their marriage or civil partnership, which sets out their financial assets and in the unfortunate event that their marriage or civil partnership ends, it sets out exactly how they intend to divide these assets. 

[00:04:30] Carla: So they almost agree it before the actual, before that happens, hopefully it won’t happen, but, but then it covers, it covers them both, I suppose, should the worst happen?

[00:04:41] Eve: Absolutely. It’s almost like an insurance policy. It’s a form of relationship planning. So you hope, of course, when you’re entering into a marriage that nothing is going to go wrong, you’re going to be together forever. But as you and I both know, that’s not always the case for everyone. So it’s just like a form of insurance, really, just in case the worst happens, it will set out exactly what the party’s intentions were at the outset of their marriage.

[00:05:09] Carla: That’s brilliant. That’s a great explanation. So what actually can be covered then in a prenup? 

[00:05:15] Eve: So typically it will set out the assets of the parties and the assets can be property in this country or abroad, um, typically a couple share a home together. So that would be known as the family home, but they may have other investment properties as well.

[00:05:34] It would set out their pensions and possibly their income and record if they were to, um, divorce or, dissolve their civil partnership, what would happen in those circumstances. And, um, it’s, it’s advisable to try and plan for possible eventuality, such as if the parties are intending of having children. And so you might want to, um, when drafting a prenuptial agreement, I would want to introduce, um, sort of a review clause to, to take account of certain important events and possibly, um, if it’s not the birth of any children and the couple aren’t intending to have children, maybe just have a review clause at maybe five-year intervals, because of course the parties circumstances may change throughout the life of that marriage. So it’s quite a good idea to keep the agreement as fresh as possible.

[00:06:33] Carla: Of course. Yeah. Because you circumstances are always changing aren’t they throughout your marriage. So that, that does make sense. So why. I mean, why do most people use them then? Is it from previous bad experiences or? 

[00:06:47] Eve: Yeah, so it could be exactly that they could’ve been married before and had a particularly difficult separation and divorce, but often people will use prenups to say safeguard, inheritances. Possibly they’ve already received a significant inheritance or they are anticipating a significant inheritance. And they want to safeguard that it might be that one or both parties has business interests that were acquired prior to the marriage. And they want to ring fence those as well.

[00:07:24] Um, so it’s, it’s really, um, I think that parties that perhaps enter a relationship with a similar level of assets probably wouldn’t think about a prenuptial agreement, but if there is a significant disparity, then it’s more common for parties to be thinking about protecting assets that they bought in. And particularly if they are considerably more than the other party. 

[00:07:51] Carla: That makes a lot of sense. And sometimes do you find the people who have been married before, like what we said then, but they’ve got their own children. Maybe they’re not going to have children in the future. Would that be something that they use, you know, um, just to protect the children from, from?

[00:08:09] Eve: Yes, that’s absolutely right. I mean, obviously it’s advisable for parties to have wills in place. This is like another layer of protection because the starting point, if you divorce in this jurisdiction, there are factors which may affect this. But starting point typically is an equalization so a 50/50 split.

[00:08:29] So you can see that if a party has perhaps been widowed or they have separated before and they have property and assets in their previous relationship, they want to safeguard their children. This would be an ideal way of doing so. 

[00:08:46] Carla: That’s brilliant. Yeah, I did wonder about that. That’s great. So it’s another level of protection like you, you nicely put there. So how common are prenuptial agreements in the UK? Are they getting more common? 

[00:08:59] Eve: Yes. So they are certainly becoming more common. There was an important case known as Radmacher, which was decided by the Supreme court in 2010. And before that time, I think there was definitely a reluctance by the court to recognize prenuptial agreements. There was some case law which supported agreements that were fairly and properly entered into between parties. But this particular case, which was quite heavily reported changed the landscape, certainly for family lawyers. And basically just in a nutshell, that case was concerned with a German heiress and a French national husband, and they entered into a prenup four months before they married. And even though the prenup wasn’t translated into English for the parcel to the husband, it was still upheld by the court as one of the circumstance, the court should have regard to. The parties were basically, they were similar ages and they went on to have two children. Uh, I think they married in 1998. But they separated eight years later. And at the start of the marriage the husband was working at JP Morgan. And was earning a fairly significant sum, but the purpose behind the prenup was actually to protect the German heiress and her inheritance that she’d already received and her wealth that she anticipated receieving in the future, um, and the court felt that actually in that circumstance, because both parties knew, what they were enterting into, it was proper um, the agreement to be upheld. The only, um, matter to raise in that regard was it didn’t make provison for the parties two children’s. So they’d gone on to have two children. And so there was an adjustment by the court to take account of the children needs.

[00:10:54] But basically the Supreme court set out in that case, quite helpfully, how much an agreement should be treated. And they said that the court should give effect to a nuptial agreement that is freely entered into, by each party with a full appreciation of its implications. Unless in the circumstances prevailing, it would not be fair to hold the parties to their agreement.

[00:11:20] So that case was so important. And the recommendation was that really, um, the agreement needs to be shown to be freely entered into. So obviously there shouldn’t be any pressure or duress either side. And I think that in that case, and they were suggesting at least 21 days ahead of the marriage, the agreement should be entered into. The law commission has gone on to say their recommendation would be 28 days ahead of their marriage.

[00:11:51] But my advice would be to anyone thinking about having prenup, give yourself as much time as possible before you actually marry. So before the date of the marriage. Because what you want to do is we can’t say, these agreements are absolutely 100% binding, but if both parties have entered into the agreements freely, they’ve said, I dunno maybe two or three months ahead of the marriage thinking about entering into the agreement, they have taken legal advice and both parties know what assets and income the other party has.

[00:12:31] I think there’s a very good chance of court upholding that agreement. If any of those elements haven’t been thought about. So one of the parties hasn’t sought legal advise, or they haven’t shared their financial disclosure. There is a reason then potentially that the court may not uphold that agreement.

[00:12:52] So basically you want to do whatever you have to give the court as much power as possible to make the agreement and to not think actually, oh gosh, is this agreement not fair? Um, and as far as possible, we want to think about having, like I said before a review clause, just to revisit the agreement at certain key events, um, to then against the court and argument, um, the court says, you know, the disagreement doesn’t seem to be fair. The parties have reviewed it quite regularly. It would be much harder for the court to say that. 

[00:13:25] Carla: Yeah. Yeah, that makes sense. Gosh. Wow. That was, that’s quite, um, quite a lot of information there that makes. No but it really does make sense. So why then would you say it’s important to seek legal advice when entering the prenup?

[00:13:40] Eve: It’s mainly just to show that the parties are on a level playing field. So that one party is not influencing the other. And if both parties have gone to independent legal advisors and had proper independent advice themselves. Again, it’s going to be much harder for the court not to uphold it. The court wants to uphold these agreements and if you, both, both parties go and see independent solicitors. That’s sort of one of the boxes ticked if you like. The court can be satisfied. Yes. This party knew ahead of executing the agreement. Absolutely what they were signing up to. 

[00:14:18] Carla: That’s brilliant. Brilliant. So, so w when I suppose we’ve covered this a little bit, but just to be a bit clearer, when can you enter into a prenup then?

[00:14:29] Eve: So a prenup would be entered into before a couple decide to marry, or to enter into civil partnership. If a couple are getting a little bit close to the date of the wedding, it’s still possible for them to enter into a prenup, but it may be advisable for the parties once they’re married. Also think about a post-nuptial agreement.

[00:14:52] So, um, that is, that can mirror entirely the terms of the prenup. Um, but it’s just to safeguard against these arguments that I’ve just raised about there being any pressure or duress. Cause you want to be able to say to the court look, um, you know, we absolutely knew what we were signing up to and if it was on the eve of the wedding, much better to have another agreement after the marriage, recording exactly what they’ve signed up to, but demonstrating to the court that either once they were married, this is absolutely how they want to deal with their assets. In the unfortunate event, their marriage does break down. 

[00:15:29] Carla: Yeah. Yeah. Cause I can imagine like the eve of a wedding when you’ve got everyone there, your dress is hanging up. You get a text from your partner about, uh, you know, a pre-nuptial agreement. You know, of course you’re going to be more inclined to kind of go with it. So, uh, a post one just kind of, I suppose it, I see what you mean in regards to the court, looking at it and saying, well, actually, you know, they have discussed it after the event as well 

[00:15:57] Eve: Yeah absolutely because the court’s going to be looking at the emotional state of the parties, their ages and their understand, understanding of the agreement. and their respective financial circumstances. The court really just wants to be satisfied. They both really understand what’s going on. One party is not pressurizing the other party. They’re freely entering into it. Um, and in that circumstance, the parties have a very good chance of having the agreement up held.

[00:16:25] Carla: That’s great. That’s great. So, so with pre-nuptial agreements, then are they legally binding as such then? 

[00:16:33] Eve: So they’re not, only in as much as it takes, really for you to obtain a decree absolute and a financial order approved by the court for it to be binding. So whilst a prenuptial agreement is a good insurance policy because it’s impossible for parties to crystal ball gaze entirely, and there maybe circumstances which come up, which the parties don’t expect.

[00:17:04] The court still has to retain its discretion to look at all the circumstances of the case upon a relationship breakdown. So I think that if the parties enter, go through the steps we’ve just talked about. So enter into the agreement as far ahead of the wedding as they possible can, disclose their assets, income and liabilites, get independent legal advice, and basically show the court that they’ve done everything within a timely manner. They ticked all the boxes and it’s likely the court due to uphold it. But if the agreement hasn’t taken account of, let’s say children being born. The court is always going to prioritize the needs of any children and needs basically gasumps all. So the agreement fundamentally has to be fair. So if the agreement is not held to be fair, then the court won’t honor it.

[00:18:01] So it’s better to have a prenup than not. And it’s important that you go through all of those steps, but we can’t say yes, absolutely it’s concrete. Because there are certain circumstances that might happen that the parties can’t foresee that the court is going to want to take account of in any final resolution with their finances.

[00:18:21] Carla: Yeah, that that makes a lot of sense. So, so in regards to the postnups, um, just a bit further details on those. If you were five, 10 years down into your relationship and you were going to come into quite a large inheritance, um, could you at that point, even if you’ve never had a prenup, then say, you know, I don’t know how the conversation would go with your partner, but could you get a postnup at that point? 

[00:18:50] Eve: Yes, absolutely. You get a postnup at any time in post-marriage or civil partnerships certainly. And obviously the other party needs to be in agreement, but there’s no reason why they wouldn’t be. And safeguarding inheritances is a very common reason why parties might think about it. I mean, obviously if the other party is unwilling to enter into a postnup. There’s not a great deal that can be done about that. But its certainly something that if both parties are on board with why not get one absolutely. 

[00:19:25] Carla: Brilliant. That’s really good to know. So we’ve covered, obviously you’d review your prenup and your postnup and at different stages. Um, so. Can you challenge your prenup? Um, you know, at a later date, if you did come to split up and you have kind of, um, say you’ve done these every five years, you’ve reviewed your prenup or your postnup. Um, could you then say you did split up? Could you challenge what, what you’ve already kind of put down?

[00:19:55] Eve: Yes. You, you can, um, even in this case of Radmacher that we were just talking about, that’s basically what the husband was doing. And because in that case, their circumstances had changed. They’ve gone on to have two children. The court agreed with the husband in that prespect that actually he needed more money just to support him as a father. Um, so, so again, in that circumstance that the husband was challenging saying that, um, the agreement didn’t cover him. It wasn’t sufficient to meet his needs as a father. And, and they had the parties had a shared care arrangement in relation to the children. So a lot of the case law that I might see is, is parties actually challenging these agreements and saying to the judge, it’s not fair judge, because look, this has happened and that’s happened, which is why ideally as much as possible you review it as regularly as possible to avoid that happening because they aren’t, we can’t say they’re were a hundred percent binding.

[00:20:56] Carla: That’s great. I mean, if, if you doing the prenup or postnup, you could both just say to each other look, this is what we’re going to do every, so every, so many years. So it doesn’t come as a shock when the other person says, oh, it’s coming to that time again. This is just what you do. So. 

[00:21:12] Eve: Absolutely, you can build it into the agreement and it might be that, actually their circumstances really haven’t changed. In which case you would still be best served to update the agreement. So at least the parties have thought about it. Has anything changed? Do we want to make any revisions? No. So you would still have a, perhaps a fresh agreement and redated so that, you know, it’s clear they have revisited it, but it doesn’t mean that the circumstances have necessarily changed. It’s just keeping it fresh. 

[00:21:39] Carla: Yeah, that makes sense. And are that, any the options available that are like prenuptial agreement? 

[00:21:45] Eve: So I mean, obviously not every couple marrying is going to have a prenuptial agreement. And like I said, in lots of circumstances, particularly if the parties have a similar amount of wealth, they’re not going to think about it.

[00:22:01] Um, but I suppose. Um, if a couple were thinking, well, actually, look, we’re not going to get married and we don’t want to enter into civil partnership, but we are going to live together, going to co-habit. It might be advisable for them to enter into a living together agreement, which again, it’s not binding, but it’s going to show. Um, what their intentions are at the outset of their relationship. And certainly if a co-habiting couple are purchasing a property together, for example, and one party might be putting in more of the deposit and so on, they might want to enter into the living together arrangement. They might also want to have a deed of trust or a declaration of trust to show that they hold the property together as tenants in common, but actually beneficially one party has more of an interest than the other party just to reflect the imbalance of the monies put into the property at the outset. So that’s just another way of, um, relationship planning. If you don’t want to, to marry or enter into a civil partnership. 

[00:23:04] Carla: That’s brilliant. Goodness. You’ve answered so much. And I didn’t realize there was so much to it, but it sounds, it sounds quite simple as well, really, but once you’ve kind of covered everything, but that that’s great.

[00:23:18] So Eve, where would people find you then? Um, if they want to get in touch with you for more information on this particular subject, can they email you?

[00:23:27] Eve: They certainly can so I am soliciting like I’ve said for Parfitt Cresswell, and my office. My main office I work from is the Coleman solicitor’s office so thats Padackhall Chambers in Haywoods Heath.

[00:23:42] But my email address, if anyone wants to contact me is E G so my initials and my telephone number. If they want to speak to me is 01444 459 555. 

[00:24:00] Carla: Thats amazing. Thank you so much for your time today, Eve that was really, really useful.

[00:24:05] Eve: No problem at all. Its a pleasure thank you.

[00:24:07] Carla: Thank you.

[00:24:09] Thank you for listening to My Bump 2 Baby’s Expert podcast. If you would like to find help and support from experts in your local area, head over to and you will also be able to find local pregnancy to preschool groups, classes, businesses, and services in your local.

The post Everything you need to know about Prenuptial Agreements appeared first on MyBump2Baby Podcasts.

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Child Arrangements following a Relationship Breakdown Fri, 17 Dec 2021 11:39:49 +0000 In todays podcast Carla Lett speaks with expert family law solicitor Zanariah Webster from Parfitt Cresswell.
Zanariah answers and discusses all your questions about child arrangements following the breakdown of a relationship.

The post Child Arrangements following a Relationship Breakdown appeared first on MyBump2Baby Podcasts.

  • Child Arrangements following a Relationship Breakdown

In todays podcast Carla Lett speaks with expert family law solicitor Zanariah Webster from Parfitt Cresswell.

Zanariah answers and discusses all your questions about child arrangements following the breakdown of a relationship. 

They discuss about if court is absolutely necessary, if mothers have great rights than fathers, how maintenance works, laws around relocations and holidays plus much more.

Email address is

The firm offers a complimentary 30 minute consultation so if anyone requires advice on any aspect of family law, please feel free to contact us on 0333 016 4358

[00:00:00] Carla: My Bump 2 Baby is one of the UKs leading parenting platforms. You can find local pregnancy to preschool groups, classes, and lessons, wherever you are in the UK. Not only that, but you can read our honest reviews on the latest products, days out and services that you as parents need to know about. We also work with trusted financial advisors, family law, solicitors, and now estate agents, too.

[00:00:33] If you would like to find your nearest, trusted expert, head over to

[00:00:46] Are you a parent looking to start a small business, perhaps you’ve no idea where to start. Or maybe you’ve already got a small business and you’re struggling to take it to that next level. My Bump 2 Baby is here to support you. My Bump 2 Baby Business offers training packages, mentorship programs, one-to-one support, and e-courses, if you would like more information on how to grow your business with My Bump 2 Baby.

[00:01:19] Then email us. Our email address is

[00:01:35] Hello, and welcome to My Bump 2 Baby expert podcast, where we bring experts from all over the UK to answer your questions on everything, pregnancy to preschool.

[00:02:01] Today, we are talking all about child arrangements and I am joined by family law solicitor Zanariah Webster from Parfitt Cresswell. I hope you enjoy this podcast.

[00:02:21] Hello, everybody. Welcome to My Bump 2 Baby’s Expert podcast. Today I am joined by Zanariah Webster family law solicitor at Parfitt Cresswell. And today we’re going to be covering child arrangements. Hi Zanariah how are you?

[00:02:39] Zanariah: I’m fine. Thank you Carla. How are you? 

[00:02:41] Carla: I’m very well, thank you very well. So Zanariah, can you tell us a little bit about you?

[00:02:48] Zanariah: Um, yes, of course, Carla I’m a family solicitor, and I’m working in Parfitt Cresswell in the Windsor office. Um, I’m 13 PQE so I’ve actually been qualified for 13 years, although I’ve been in the profession for almost 20, um, I deal with all aspects of matrimonial law. So divorce, financial settlements, child arrangements, cohabitation, uh, grandparents’ rights, and also nuptial agreements. So we really cover every area under matrimonial law.

[00:03:20] Carla: Amazing. So you cover quite, quite a large, a large audience there. 

[00:03:25] Zanariah: Yes, I do. 

[00:03:26] Carla: So in regards to child arrangements, then, um, if someone separates from their partner, do they have to go to court? 

[00:03:34] Zanariah: Um, not necessarily. And if anything, it’s advisable that parents try to resolve things away from the court arena. Um, court proceedings are very stressful. They can take quite a lot of time and also they’re, they’re potentially quite costly. So what I would always recommend is that where possible try to have an open dialogue with your partner and try to resolve issues, um, away from, um, going to court and away from solicitors.

[00:04:04] What solicitors can help you with is try to put forward an informal arrangement between the both of you, so that you have something documented in writing as to how often the child is going to spend with one parent, who’s going to pay for their activities. Who’s going, you know how often they can have the children during holidays. Solicitors can help with that. But if communication breaks down totally, then there’ll be no choice, but to apply for a child arrangements order, which under the old term used to be called custody, people still use that terminology quite a lot, but it’s essentially what it is. Just custody and yeah child arrangements now. 

[00:04:44] Carla: Right. Okay. That’s brilliant. Thank you for that. And, and do mothers have greater rights than fathers over children now when it comes to custody?

[00:04:54] Zanariah: This is actually a myth. And I think it’s perpetuated by a lot of the stories that you see in the press or the media, but the law sees the mother and the father as equal, whether they’re married or unmarried and what’s important and is actually the court’s paramount consideration is the welfare of the child.

[00:05:16] So that means who is able to meet the child’s daily, physical, emotional, psychological, and educational needs, and that the court would want to view that both parents are able to do that. Now, if there are issues with one parent then the court will step in and put in some measures, or they might restrict contact somehow, but every case is dependent on its circumstances.

[00:05:42] Now, if a child is particularly young, so if they’re a newborn or, you know, a toddler. There’s a slight balance towards the mothers only because of the care that the mothers can give that fathers just biologically aren’t able to, but essentially the mothers and the fathers are treated equally in the eyes of the law.

[00:06:04] Carla: Wow. Right. Okay. That’s brilliant. Yeah. I think a lot of these TV programs and stuff like that don’t help with things like that. 

[00:06:12] Zanariah: They don’t which is why I never watched them. 

[00:06:15] Carla: That makes sense. That makes sense. So touching on that a bit more then, so the courts, when it comes to deciding who the child will live with, obviously if they’re younger, I get what you’re saying about, about the mother. Um, maybe being a bit more available to their needs. Um, but in regards to, um, deciding other than that, when the child’s older, is that a decision the child would make then or you know, uh, how would that work? 

[00:06:41] Zanariah: Potentially a child can make the decision. So whenever a parent applies for a child arrangements order, which is a court order, um, there will be a Cafcass officer who was a child welfare officer who will be involved in the case. And their job is to take out, to carry out safeguarding and to find out what the issues are with the family. Now, the older, the child is the presumption is that they’re able to voice who they want to spend time with. And it is quite, the older the child is the stronger their influence is with the judge, but this has to be balanced against what the court welfare officer feel is of the best interest of the child, the circumstances surrounding the parental breakup, and also whether one parent can unduly exert their influence over the other parent. It’s a term called parental alienation and it can put a child at a very difficult position, but generally the older the child is the more better they are at voicing their own opinions. 

[00:07:42] Carla: Yeah, that must be so hard for children to do when they are put in the middle of it.

[00:07:46] Zanariah: Definitely they are yeah. 

[00:07:48] Carla: So what orders could I ask the court to make then?

[00:07:52] Zanariah: So there is quite a wide range of orders you could ask the court. So you could ask the court for an order for a child to live with you. Um, and to spend time with the other parent. So this is the old terminology of custody. They’ve sort of, the terminology has changed to make the whole process a little less hostile.

[00:08:11] Um, you could ask, you could ask the court if you wanted to move, you know to another part of the country, you could ask for a specific issue order for that to happen. Or you could ask for something to stop the court, ask the court to stop something from happening, which is called a prohibited steps order. So for example, if you had a child and the other parent wanted to take that child to another country that you know nothing about, there are no connections to, you can ask the court to prohibit that from happening.

[00:08:40] And you could also, the other thing I mentioned earlier was a specific issue that is something like asking for specific medical treatment for a child or asking for the court to change the child’s surname.

[00:08:54] Carla: Yeah. Yeah so there’s quite a few different orders there. Isn’t there really?

[00:08:57] Zanariah: Yes there are, there are. 

[00:08:59] Carla: What about, um, just touching on moving. What about if a parent decided that they wanted to move to the other end of the country? Does that, is that the same or, or is that worked out differently. 

[00:09:12] Zanariah: Um, if there is child arrangements in place between the parents, then it’s not one parent’s right to up and move and take the child with them. It’s quite a serious matter because it not only disrupts the child’s education and their, you know, their social life, so to speak, but also it can disrupt the, the contact that they have with a non resident parent.

[00:09:34] My advice would be is that if you were planning on moving to the other side of the country, you will need to, you should discuss this with the other parent. And if that doesn’t work, the non resident, parent can actually make an application to the court for the court to consider where the child should live. And in that the courts have quite a delicate balancing act to do, because they’ve got to weigh up. The parents need to move abroad, not abroad, but the other side of the country for work, for whatever purposes against the child’s relationship with the parent, that’s remaining, it’s a very difficult balance. And it’s something that the court do not take lightly. And whether the, the person is going to move to the other side of the country or abroad, the same sort of requirements are, are expected from both parties.

[00:10:24] Carla: Yeah, totally understandable isn’t it? If one partner has no contact with the child whatsoever, um, then can a parent still ask for maintenance from that parent? How would they go about that? 

[00:10:40] Zanariah: They can absolutely ask for maintenance. Seeing your child is not linked to financial maintenance. So what you would need to, you should do, is actually go to the child maintenance service. So they used to be called the child support agency. And if you know how much your ex partner is earning, you could actually put down what their gross annual salary is.

[00:11:00] Um, and you, the child maintenance service will calculate how much is owed to you. If you don’t know how much they earn. But you have an idea of where they are send the CMS, their details, and the CMS will make contact with them, to make payments and is dependent on their salary. So they would have to disclose their payslips and it’s usually deducted at source. Um, and this is irrespective of whether that parent sees the child or not. 

[00:11:26] Carla: That’s great. Yeah, because that extra support, I mean, children cost a lot, don’t they? So, yeah. 

[00:11:33] Zanariah: Yes they do.

[00:11:34] Carla: That makes, that makes sense. So, so in regards to the maintenance, again, just a bit deeper on that one. If someone hasn’t been paying say for a year or two years, would the payments then be backdated or not?

[00:11:50] Zanariah: Potentially they can be. It depends on when the case is opened with the CMS. So as far as I know, uh, if you open up a case today or you don’t receive any payment until I don’t know until six months time that it can be backdated to the time that you actually opened the application any earlier than that, you will need to make specific inquiries with the child maintenance service. And they will look at it as a case by case basis.

[00:12:15] Carla: Yeah, it’s just good to know that you’ve got that support there. 

[00:12:19] Zanariah: Yeah because children are expensive and a lot of people are under the misdemeanour, that child mated it is to pay for activities and clothes and shoes, but it’s not, it can go towards bills and rent because all those things go towards maintaining a child. 

[00:12:37] Carla: Yeah, of course. And, and a lot of parents. The parents who, who have the child, their work hours might work around the school hours. So they can’t work as much, you know, term time. So yeah, no, that, that makes a lot of sense. Um, so can someone change their child’s surname without their partner’s permission?

[00:12:58] Zanariah: Unfortunately, no, they do need their, the partner’s permission, uh, the courts view a child’s surname as part of their identity and to change it without knowing, without the other parent, knowing is sort of excluding that parent from the child’s life. If you can’t, if you don’t know the whereabouts of this parent, or they don’t make any concerted effort to see the child, you could apply to the court for a specific issue order. For the court to decide that the child surname could be changed, but they’re given in very rare circumstances. It has to be very good reasons as to why a child would, why you would want to change a child’s surname. 

[00:13:39] Carla: That makes sense. So say for example, me and my partner had split up and he doesn’t really have much to do with, with the child. Can I take my child abroad? If my partner and I are separated? 

[00:13:54] Zanariah: Yes, you can. You can take your child, your child aboard. Did you say you are in contact with the, with the partner or not? 

[00:14:01] Carla: Yeah. Well, if I was in contact with the partner, um, and I wanted to take my child on holiday, that would be okay?

[00:14:09] Zanariah: Yes, that would be okay. As long as you give the other parent an itinerary as to where you’re going, where you’re staying, when you’re going to be returning. And as long as that country isn’t a high risk jurisdiction, and there are ties to that country and it works both ways. Uh, the other parent cannot refuse, uh, permission unreasonably.

[00:14:29] So for example, if you wanted to take your child to Disney World, but the other parent objected because they wanted to be the parent to take the child to Disney World. That’s not a reason to refuse taking the child abroad. Uh, it’s gotta to be quite a serious reason. So if you’re going to a high risk country, that that’s not a member of the Hague convention, and there are no ties to it then that parent can say, whoa, I don’t want you to take the child abroad. But if it’s just, you know, uh, to a safe country, you’ve give it all the details to the other, the other partner, there is no reason why you can’t take that child abroad. 

[00:15:05] Carla: That’s brilliant. And, um, you know, when we talk about, um, taking my child abroad on holiday, if me and my partner have separated, um, is there a timeframe that I’m allowed to take my child on holiday for, is there a maximum amount of time? 

[00:15:23] Zanariah: So, yeah. So where there is an order that states that the child is living with one parent. So that’s lives with order. That parent can take the child abroad for 28 days without the written consent of the parents. But practically speaking, I think is always a good idea to, um, let the other parent know that you are taking that, that child abroad because you would expect them to follow the same procedure and follow that same courtesy.

[00:15:52] Uh, it’s very difficult. I can understand to sometimes maintain civil after a separation, but it’s for the benefit of the child. And you would want to know where your child is anyway, so you don’t need written consent, but you should at least have that just to, uh, as a matter of courtesy. 

[00:16:09] Carla: Definitely. And it keeps that relationship in, in a good place. Doesn’t it? 

[00:16:13] Zanariah: Absolutely. Yeah. So that’s important. 

[00:16:15] Carla: That’s great. Brilliant. So how can I improve communication with my ex partner when we do discuss child arrangements? Have you got any kind of tips on that? 

[00:16:25] Zanariah: Uh, there are a lot of apps out there that my clients use to, to help with communication. There’s one app called Close App that you can download and it’s used specifically for communication regarding the child. So anything outside of that arena, you just would not put it on. And I think it’s always a good idea when you are communicating with your partner to, conversations should be civil. And, they should be child-focused and child centric. And if things are a bit rocky with your ex partner, they should always be written with a view that it might go in front of a judge.

[00:17:04] Carla: Okay, that’s brilliant. Gosh, we’ve covered quite a lot there. There’s so much to cover. Um, on where, where could people find you Zanariah? If they want to ask you some more questions on this subject? 

[00:17:16] Zanariah: Um, so we, our website is The firm offers a 30 minute complimentary initial consultation. Its no obligation and it’s a really good way of finding out what your rights are before you proceed to the next step. Uh, I could give you my email address its Um, I’m more than happy to communicate with anyone who has a question about this because it’s such a mind field and there’s so much information out there and talking to friends or Googling it. Is as, as much as, as well meaning as friends, that can be, it can make you even feel even more overwhelmed and confused. So wherever you need that legal advice. I would strongly advised to seek that from an expert. 

[00:18:06] Carla: Absolutely also laws change don’t they quite often. 

[00:18:09] Zanariah: Absolutely.

[00:18:09] Carla: So what was for one parent, you know, 10 years ago, maybe very well different now 

[00:18:14] Zanariah: Yeah and every situation is different. So I get a lot of people who say when it comes to financial, uh, disagreements, for example, they say, well, that person was able to take the house, the pension. You know, they got spousal support, why can’t I? And the main reason for that is because every family life is different. Every situation is different. And that’s what the courts look at. It’s not a one size fits all. Which is a good thing because every family dynamic works differently. Uh, so what may work for one person may not actually work for you?

[00:18:48] Carla: That makes sense. That’s brilliant. Well Zanariah thank you so much for coming on today. That’s been really, really helpful. 

[00:18:55] Zanariah: Thank you so much for having me it’s been a pleasure. 

[00:19:00] Carla: Thank you for listening to My Bump 2 Baby’s Expert podcast. If you would like to find help and support from experts in your local area, head over to and you will also be able to find local pregnancy to preschool groups, classes, businesses, and services in your local area.

The post Child Arrangements following a Relationship Breakdown appeared first on MyBump2Baby Podcasts.

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Changing Your Career Joining Tumble Tots Fri, 10 Dec 2021 11:13:26 +0000 In today’s expert podcast Carla Lett chats with Charlotte Bedford the Franchise Development Manager at Tumble Tots, they talk about becoming a franchise owner for Tumble tots.

The post Changing Your Career Joining Tumble Tots appeared first on MyBump2Baby Podcasts.

  • Changing Your Career Joining Tumble Tots

In today’s expert podcast Carla Lett chats with Charlotte Bedford the Franchise Development Manager at Tumble Tots, they talk about becoming a franchise owner for Tumble tots, what it entails, the benefits and also the financial aspects too.



[00:00:00] Carla: My Bump 2 Baby is one of the UKs leading parenting platforms. You can find local pregnancy to preschool groups, classes, and lessons, wherever you are in the UK. Not only that, but you can read our honest reviews on the latest products, days out and services that you as parents need to know about. We also work with trusted financial advisors, family law, solicitors, and now estate agents, too.

[00:00:33] If you would like to find your nearest, trusted expert, head over to

[00:00:46] Are you a parent looking to start a small business, perhaps you’ve no idea where to start. Or maybe you’ve already got a small business and you’re struggling to take it to that next level. My bumps baby is here to support you. My Bump 2 Baby Business offers training packages, mentorship programs, one-to-one support, and e-courses, if you would like more information on how to grow your business with My Bump 2 Baby.

[00:01:19] Then email us. Our email address is

[00:01:35] Hello, and welcome to My Bump 2 Baby Expert podcast, where we bring experts from all over the UK to answer your questions on everything, pregnancy to preschool.

[00:02:00] Today I am joined by the lovely Charlotte Bedford from Tumble Tots. Charlotte is the franchise development manager, and today we’re going to be talking all about joining Tumble Tots, the process, the benefits and everything you need to know if you are interested in joining the team. I hope you enjoyed this episode.

[00:02:26] Hello everybody. And welcome to My Bump 2 Baby’s Expert podcast. Today I am joined by the lovely Charlotte Bedford the franchise development manager for Tumble Tots. Hi Charlotte, how are you? 

[00:02:42] Charlotte: I’m good. Thank you. You?

[00:02:44] Carla: Yes, very well. Thank you very well. So today we’re going to be talking a little bit about flexible working, going back to work, and then finding a business that works around you and your family.

[00:02:56] So I’m really excited to talk about. Because obviously with My Bump 2 Baby, I started that business during maternity leave. And I really didn’t want to go back to my full nine to five job. 

[00:03:08] Charlotte: Not many people do. 

[00:03:11] Carla: I know that’s the thing. Do you know what though? I always thought I always thought, oh yeah. Yeah. I’ll definitely go back full time. And as soon as I had my little boy, I was like, oh no. And when you look at childcare fees as well, oh, my goodness.

[00:03:25] Charlotte: A lot of my friends now they are, they are finding that they are working just to put their children into childcare. And it’s just a bit like, well, what, why am I even doing this? It’s it’s crazy. Isn’t it? 

[00:03:39] Carla: It really is. Honestly. And then if you have another one as well, throw them into the mix blooming hell it’s like having another house.

[00:03:50] Charlotte: It’s crazy. 

[00:03:51] Carla: It is. So we find a lot of our parents that come on My Bump 2 Baby to find local groups and classes. Um, a lot of them are kind of open to the idea of running their own business and finding their own thing that works for them and around the family. So we’re going to touch on, also the benefits of becoming a Tumble Tots franchise owner. Now, first of all, I just want to say if you’ve not been to the classes and you’ve got a local one in your area, Honestly, they are brilliant. My little George absolutely loved them and do you know they tired him out as well, which was even better because I got a hot brew when I got home 

[00:04:29] Charlotte: They are brilliant. And, you know, we find that a lot of parents are like. I’m exhausted. now as well, so, and it’s, it’s a great, it’s a great sort of parent child. I know I’m very biased, but it is a great parent child activity. And like you said, it just wears, wears them out. We get so many pictures of little ones in their car seats after Tumble Tots. Just clonked out. Because they’re just exhausted, but it’s great. 

[00:04:55] Carla: It is. Can you tell us a little bit about the classes for people that haven’t been to your classes? And so we can cover that.

[00:05:02] Charlotte: Yeah. So, um, Tumble Tots, we’re a physical play program. So we basically run 45 minute classes, for, um, children for specific ages and development stages. So. Babies start when they’re six months and we have our sort of baby class and then they work their way through until they go off to school in their different classes. So the way, it’s so hard to describe Tumble Tots as sort of one sentence, but the best way I think is, is like it’s a PE lesson for your toddler where they’re having fun, they’re playing, but then also you’re actively as the parent involved in the class as well.

[00:05:38] So it’s, it is great fun for children, for parents. And I always say for the staff and franchisees as well. I, whenever I get the opportunity to work in classes. I love it. I’m always like a Duracell Bunny, that I’m wound up and wound up and I just throw everything at it because it’s, it’s impossible not to have fun in our, in our environment. And whatever’s going on sort of at home or in the outside world. Soon as those doors open to the classes, the music’s playing. And the children come in, beaming and full of energy. That is the best, the best feeling, it really is. 

[00:06:13] Carla: Oh, amazing. That is a really good way to describe it. So, so, um, with, um, obviously flexible working around maternity, obviously Tumble Tots, you are a franchise, so people can actually buy into a Tumble Tots business. So could you. You’ve told us a bit about Tumble Tots as a class. Now, can you tell us a bit about being a franchise owner of Tumble Tots? 

[00:06:39] Charlotte: Yeah. So franchising is a great opportunity whereby you buy into, as a franchisee, a well-known brand, a concept that works really well and thats established. However, what it does provide you is the opportunity to run your own business. You’re a business owner and you drive and push and develop that business as much as you want to with our full support, our advice, our expertise, and in terms of sort of a Tumble Tots franchisee, um, your sort of responsible for running the classes with a team. So you have your own, your own staff. But then also you’re responsible for sort of the operational side of it.

[00:07:21] So how are you going to develop that business? How are you going to get the Tumble Tots name out in your local area and how are you going to sort of keep those little ones keep coming in and coming in? So it’s, it’s a great franchise opportunity in terms of the, it uses sort of two aspects. So, if you love working with children and you get a real buzz from that, you’ve got that side of it, but then you’ve also got the other side of actually running your own business and what that takes as well. And combining the two. And actually it really does give a good balance, whereas you’re not stuck behind a desk all day, running a business. Actually for the most part of the day, you’re in classes getting in amongst with the children, the parents, and then you do have the other sort of aspect where you actually, yeah. You do need to sit down sometimes at a desk, but not, not as much as you wouldn’t necessarily within the businesses. 

[00:08:16] Carla: I suppose it’s, it’s good in some ways, cause people have different personalities. Don’t they? See I am a desker and I, I, you know, that side of things, but then, you know, as, as they grow the business, I mean, I imagine, you know, they could have staff looking after different classes and they could be a bit more behind the scenes or they could be more up front depending on what they, they want to do.

[00:08:37] Charlotte: Yeah and it very much depends on their own circumstances as well. So we’ve got some franchisee. Um, with very young children. So they might work in their classes maybe three days a week, and then their team look after the classes for two days a week. Knowing full well that the franchisee is very much still in control very much in the business. However, that’s, that’s one of the flexibilities of Tumble Tots is that, you know, we understand, and a lot of our franchisees have young children.

[00:09:09] So actually it works really, really well for them. And going back to sort of childcare is that, you know, if they, if they only want to put their child into nursery, maybe two days, then that’s fine. They operate those two days. They might have their child one day and it’s a, it’s a good juggling act. So you’re not having to fork out all of that money for childcare, as you would sometimes with sort of like a typical nine to five.

[00:09:33] Carla: That’s great. So you can kind of get it to work for you can’t you really? 

[00:09:37] Charlotte: Yeah for sure.

[00:09:38] Carla: I think the great thing about having a franchise is, you know, it’s proven method. It works, you know, look how long Tumble Tots have been around. I mean, when did it launch? 

[00:09:47] Charlotte: Yeah, so we’re, we were established in 1979, so we’re touching 43 years, which is amazing. And w when you say that you just think, oh my goodness, what, look at what has happened in those 43 years. So we’ve, we’ve got through a few recessions. We’ve got through COVID and we’re still here. We’re still going strong and. And I think that’s credit to a the classes what we actually do for children, but also our business model, our business model works. We’re a good franchise. And actually, you know, it’s, it’s a franchise that people trust as well. Parents trust to come to classes. But sort of potential franchisees trust the name because they understand that we’ve been going for so long and that we have got some amazing opportunities available. 

[00:10:38] Carla: Absolutely. Yeah. So, so with the, um, with, when you decide, right, I’m interested in a franchise, you obviously you’d have to check that your area is available cause you get a territory don’t you? Um, so, so what, what’s the process from then, then? How do they, how do they make more enquiries? 

[00:11:00] Charlotte: So the first point of call you rightly said Carla, you go onto our website and it will show the available areas that we have. Now we do have quite a few opportunities available all around the country. Um, in Wales and Scotland as well and in Northern Ireland. So there’s this great potential all around the UK at the moment. Um, then we would start by sort of giving you a brief overview of Tumble Tots. So you understand exactly what the program is and a little bit about the franchise in general. Then, what we would generally do is we would look to meet to potentially franchisee and this would involve taking them to see some classes because there’s like I said, there’s no, it’s really hard to pin down exactly what Tumble Tots is.

[00:11:46] So we find let’s take them to classes, show them what we do so they can see for themselves how amazing the classes are. Then we would follow that with an investment meeting. So we’d lay out what the investment entails. Um, and then sort of go, go from there. Really. So you probably looking, don’t get me wrong. It’s not sort of a, right I’m going to do it in a month, and that’s how we get started. You’re generally looking at between six to nine month process because it’s an important decision and we want to make sure that potential franchisees make the right decision and that we can offer sort of advice, support, and guidance in them getting to the best decision that suits that suits them.

[00:12:31] Carla: Um, yeah, that makes sense. It is. It’s a big decision, isn’t it of kind of going for a franchise? Cause you want it to be a, long-term a long-term thing, a long-term success, not just for you, but also for the person involved as well. Um, so that really sounds great. So, so price-wise then in terms of the franchise, how much does a Tumble Tots franchise cost?

[00:12:54] Charlotte: So you you’d be looking at about an investment about 25,000 pounds. It’s not all one lump sum. So we break that down and once a franchisee says, yes, I’m ready to go. We then provide them with the financial timeline. So they know exactly what is expected when and included in that is sort of a payment plan towards some of their equipment.

[00:13:19] Carla: Oh great.

[00:13:20] Charlotte: So we, what we want to do is make sure the, our franchisees can start trading before they have to keep paying us, that investment because you know, it’s a lot of money and we appreciate that. So, and we, we know that franchisees, they’re just so eager to get the classes started. So we do offer again some flexibility int that. And it’s very much dependent on a territory as well. So, um, we look at statistical information, demographic information, um, and all of that, that financial breakdown is provided to franchisees before they take that, that leap as it were. Um, franchisee would require some working capital as any small business would do.

[00:14:03] Um, this is sort of, you know, to start paying staff, their wages and hall hire and things like that. But pretty soon the money starts rolling in because obviously parents book. So the minute they book, they start paying. So actually franchisees see an income to the business pretty much straight away, which is great. That’s what we want. 

[00:14:27] Carla: Yeah, that is really good. I mean, you can certainly say as well that you are everywhere. I mean, in terms of you sponsor, My Bump 2 Baby, obviously we see you all the time on our website and stuff like that. But I mean, in terms of brand awareness, if you’re thinking of starting a baby and toddler group, you know, you’ve certainly got, you know, people know who Tumble Tots are, which massively would help as well. Um, so. If someone wanted to do it, could someone do it with someone or do you?

[00:14:58] Charlotte: Yeah.

[00:14:58] Carla: Oh, right. So if you had a friend?

[00:15:01] Charlotte: Yeah. We have a few partnerships around the country that work really, really well. And again, partnerships can work well because you generally have two different types of people, which is great, so they can bounce off one another. The only thing we always say is that when you go into a partnership, your income or your profit is halved, straight away. So that’s something that you have to bear in mind. And as long as you’re both happy with that, and you both understand the objectives of the business, that’s, that’s absolutely fine. And the, um, the few partnerships that we do have around the country work brilliantly, they absolutely do so it’s not something that is uncommon at all. Um, and it just depends how you want to run your business as well. For me, I’m quite a control freak, so I’m like to no I’m doing it on my own I’ll have my team with me, but we do, we have a partnership in, in the Newark area and they work really well. So they very rarely actually work on the same day in classes.

[00:16:04] So that’s again, another option that you can sort of mirror each other. And one is better in the classes and the other is better sort of do the operational stuff. So that’s great. That’s utilising your skills and they both get exactly what they want out of the business opportunity. 

[00:16:21] Carla: That’s brilliant. Yeah so there’s a few options. So if you kind of thought, you know, oh, I don’t like that. Like operational side of things. I want to do the classes. If you’ve got two people that are really kind of work well together. That that’s a great option as well. In terms of when, you know, people change don’t they, as time goes on, someone might, I mean, I’m sure you’ve got franchise owners that have been there years. But if they say came to retire and they said, right, it’s time to sell my business, they can, it is theirs to sell. Isn’t it? 

[00:16:56] Charlotte: Oh yeah. Yeah. 100%. So we we’re it’s a great thing actually Tumble Tots because we have a lot of franchisees who have operated their business for 5, 10, 15, 20 years just before the pandemic, we had a business that sold and the franchisee had been running it over 25 years. And it’s just incredible. So when franchisees come on board, they, they generally do stick with us because they, they fully believe in the program of what it can offer and it suits different stages of people’s lives, which is great. But when, when it does come time to maybe retire your bean bags, um, franchisees can put. And we always say sell your business because they’ll all be, always be somebody who wants to take that business now and then continue developing it. So, and we do have areas around the country that are up for sale at the moment. So the classes are operating, they’re running. And actually some people really like investing in that because they’re buying an established business. So they don’t have to worry oh I need to find a team. I need to do X. I need to do Y they’ve got an established business. But it’s still got room for growth and development, which actually suits some people much, much better. 

[00:18:13] Carla: Oh that makes sense. Yeah, that does makes sense. And in terms of selling price, is that a set price or is it based on a lot of things?

[00:18:22] Charlotte: So there’s a lot of factors involved, um, and franchisees would determine their selling price because it legally it’s their business. We would advise them on what we would think. Um, to price the business at, but ultimately it would, it would be up to them. And it’s very much dependent on how many children, they currently have attending classes.

[00:18:44] So if they have sort of five, 600 children, the business is going to be more valuable than a business that only maybe operates three days a week with 150 children. But the potential for that, for that particular business is huge. So you’re only operating three days, so you’ve got another two days to operate. Which you, could potentially double the children attending. So there’s, there’s pros and cons cons to it, for sure. 

[00:19:08] Carla: That’s great. Gosh, there’s loads of options then. So if someone wanted to speak to you further about that, are you the lady. That would talk to them Charlotte?.

[00:19:18] Charlotte: Yeah so they can get hold of us via They come in into me. Um, and we sort of start to get the ball rolling with with that. But what we like to do as well Carla is we like to put potentially franchisees in touch with other franchisees, because what we find is that. People like to know about the nitty gritty the day to day stuff sometimes. Actually, what am I getting myself into? So we generally, we put them in touch with an existing franchisee. Who does quite well. But who has also been with us for quite a while. So has seen different stages of Tumble Tots. They’ve seen different stages of their business, and actually they can give a really good reflection on what it takes day to day. The work that’s required, but also then how it does fit in to family life as well, which I think is really important for people. Especially when they’re looking for a career change. How is this going to make my personal, my family life better than what it potentially will be if I go back to my nine to five after maternity.

[00:20:26] Carla: Um, absolutely. And the thing is, I think sometimes it’s just having that scope to be able to earn even more, but in less, but working less as well. It’s a great career opportunity. Anyway, anyways, the Tumble Tots classes, like I said, I’m a huge fan of them anyway. So, so Charlotte, could you tell people where they will find you? Um, and so they can get in touch with you for more information? 

[00:20:53] Charlotte: So you can find us at Um, if you just click the franchising section there, that gives you all the information that, that you need, or you can, as I said, you can email us at and that comes directly to me. And we could start to engage with you about opportunities that we’ve got available. All we ask is if you do email us, just make sure you put your address in there. So I know where you, where you are because sometimes we get inquiries coming through. Um, and oh can you tell me some more information about a franchise and it’s, like well let me know where you are so I can see, first of all, the viability and the potential, and if, if we’ve got an existing franchisee there, then there’s no point in me wasting your time. Um, and it’s always nice to know where people are and where we would potentially be moving into. 

[00:21:43] Carla: Brilliant. That sounds excellent. So thank you so much, Charlotte, for joining me today.

[00:21:47] Charlotte: Pleasure.

[00:21:48] Carla: What we’ll do is we’ll put the links down on the bottom of this, so people know where to go to, to find more information. Okay. Thank you.

[00:21:57] Charlotte: Thank you. Bye. 

[00:22:01] Carla: Thank you for listening to My Bump 2 Baby’s Expert podcast. If you would like to find help and support from experts in your local area, head over to and you will also be able to find local pregnancy to preschool groups, classes, businesses, and services in your local area.

The post Changing Your Career Joining Tumble Tots appeared first on MyBump2Baby Podcasts.

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Benefits of Baby Swimming Thu, 18 Nov 2021 17:04:38 +0000 Today Carla Lett talks with Tamsin from Water Babies Bucks & Bed all about the benefits of baby swimming.
They talk about the benefits, when is the best time to start your baby with swimming lessons, the benefits from starting your little one swimming so young.

The post Benefits of Baby Swimming appeared first on MyBump2Baby Podcasts.

  • Benefits of Baby Swimming

Today Carla Lett talks with Tamsin from Water Babies Bucks & Bed all about the benefits of baby swimming.

They talk about the benefits, when is the best time to start your baby with swimming lessons, the benefits from starting your little one swimming so young. They touch on what your baby should wear for swimming lessons, information about the classes, class safety and the benefits of swimming for mental health for both parents and babies.

[00:00:00] Carla: My Bump 2 Baby is one of the UKs leading parenting platforms. You can find local pregnancy to preschool groups, classes, and lessons, wherever you are in the UK. Not only that, but you can read our honest reviews on the latest products, days out and services that you as parents need to know about. We also work with trusted financial advisors, family law, solicitors, and now estate agents, too. If you would like to find your nearest, trusted expert, head over to

[00:00:46] Are you a parent looking to start a small business, perhaps you’ve no idea where to start. Or maybe you’ve already got a small business and you’re struggling to take it to that next level. My Bump 2 Baby is here to support you. My Bump 2 Baby business offers training packages, mentorship programs, one-to-one support, and e-courses, if you would like more information on how to grow your business with My Bump 2 Baby.

[00:01:19] Then email us. Our email address is

[00:01:35] Hello, and welcome to MyBump 2 Baby Expert podcast, where we bring experts from all over the UK to answer your questions on everything, pregnancy to preschool.

[00:02:00] Today I am joined by the lovely Tamsin Brewis from Water Babies, and Tamsin is going to be telling us everything we need to know about baby swimming. I hope you enjoy this episode.

[00:02:21] Hello everybody. And welcome to My Bump 2 Baby’s Expert podcast. Today I am joined by the lovely Tamsin franchise owner of Water Babies Bucks & Bed. So hello, Tamsin, how are you? 

[00:02:36] Tamsin: Hi Carla. I’m very well. Very well. Thank you for having me. 

[00:02:40] Carla: Oh, thank you for joining us. Thank you so much. So Tamsin today, we’re going to be talking about the benefits of baby swimming aren’t we. And I’m really looking forward to asking you a lot of questions around this, because there are so many benefits.

[00:02:54] Tamsin: Completely there are, um, there are all the hidden benefits, as well as the, the, the ones that you, you know, the physical ones that you see. So taking your baby swimming. Uh, of course swimming is a life skill and actually getting them in the water early means that they will learn to swim earlier. So that’s the obvious one, but there are so many physical benefits working against the water, mental benefits of actually helping build brain pathways and actually bonding with parents. So yeah, there are loads and loads, um, that we can talk about today. 

[00:03:24] Carla: I’m excited for that. So Tamsin let me get started with the question of, from one of our parents, when is the best time to start your baby with swimming lessons?

[00:03:36] Tamsin: Okay. Well, I would say the best time is really when you, as the parent are ready, your baby can swim from birth, to be honest with you. There’s no reason why you can’t take them swimming from birth. Um, but the factors that define that are really things like pool temperatures. So a tiny baby, um, sort of under three months of age, really needs to go into a pool, which is a hydrotherapy pool or a warm water pool over 32 degrees.

[00:04:02] Once they’ve, they’ve sort of got to three months and around about sort of 12 pounds, six kilos in weight, then they can go into the pools of 30 degrees plus, but it’s really actually dependent on you as the parents, because you need to be ready. You need to feel confident and comfortable about coming swimming with your little one.

[00:04:20] And also you need to feel comfortable that you can juggle, you know, the swim bag with everything else that you’re dealing with as a, as a new parent. So the honest answer about it, I would say babies about three months, but parents when you’re ready. 

[00:04:34] Carla: That’s brilliant and Tamsin, what are the benefits from starting so young then?

[00:04:41] Tamsin: Um, well really starting young, um, you know, lots of people say to us, well can they swim? Can babies swim? Well no, no they can’t swim and they won’t learn to swim on the surface. Your child won’t learn to swim on the surface until they’re about two and a half, two and a half, three. However, by coming swimming with them early, you’re introducing them the worlds of physical activity and making it a family activity actually from a very young.

[00:05:05] So being, you know, your baby has just been in amniotic fluid, so the best for nine months or so, and really it’s almost like transferring them to that same sort of environment it just being a swimming pool. So coming early means that you spend time with your baby on a one-to-one basis. There’s no other interruptions except the swimming teachers or other parents in the classes, but no telephones or computers or anything like that going on.

[00:05:29] So, and that’s, one-to-one time is very, very important. It’s very good in terms of skin to skin contact with your baby. Um, I mean, I ask how many parents actually get in the bath with their babies or shower with their tiny babies, again, something which is really, really good to do with them. Uh, because again, you’re building a very good bonding experience. You’re building, um, from, from very young, you start to build up muscles, um, and, and your baby’s body muscles, um, because they’re working against water. If you think about you’re in water so its resistance that you’re working on. And you’re actually, as I say, getting into the world of physical activity, being, making that part of your family really, um, to go forward. 

[00:06:11] Carla: That’s brilliant. Yeah. I mean, there’s so many things really just making your baby stronger. And like you said, them being in amniotic fluid for so many months, you know, that that’s probably a place they’re quite familiar with isn’t really. They’ve been there mainly. 

[00:06:26] Tamsin: Yeah, completely. It’s, it’s where they’ve been. And if you know, your baby’s brain is, um, is at the stages of developing. So the experiences you give them when they’re tiny are experiences that will actually help to mold and define some of those pathways in the brain. We’re not born with a fear of water, for example. So taking them swimming, um, and you being happy in the water with them is a really positive thing. Why should we, you know, why should they actually go through a phase of actually learning a fear of water? I would say learning a respect of water is a much more important thing to be able to do.

[00:07:01] So doing things with your little ones when they’re tiny is a really nice thing to do. And you are, you know, you’re setting those foundations in place from a, from a very young age really is what you’re doing with them. 

[00:07:12] Carla: Yeah, definitely. Definitely. I know something that was, was on my mind when, when George was little was what nappies do you need to get, because I actually remember, and I’m going to share this because I want other parents to actually kind of not feel embarrassed by it. But I remember taking George in a normal nappy and it swelled massively. It was, it’s like, I don’t know if anyone’s listening that has done this, but I’ve actually put nappies in the washing machine before, and you should see the results it’s awful to deal with. So, so what nappies do you recommend that parents get for their little ones? 

[00:07:49] Tamsin: Right. So, um, I mean the swimming industry, the baby swimming industry has really developed in this area, which is fantastic. The majority of some schools and swimming pools and clubs and so forth. Will now ask for babies to wear what they call swim nappies, which tend to be paper nappies, or a reusable equivalent of a paper nappy. And you can buy those in Boots, Mothercares, the supermarkets and so forth anyway. Um, however, if you’re. Uh, sort of mindset like me about recycling. Um, you know, nappies can be, paper nappies can be a bit of a problem for that. So now you can buy cotton under nappies, um, which are lovely. Um, and, and then on top of those, you, you use what is known as a neoprene nappy known as a happy nappy. Um, and, uh, they are like little neoprene trunks really, but the most important thing about them is that they have a band around the waist and a band around the tops of the legs, which helps to contain everything.

[00:08:49] So if I’m, if I’m, if I’m being graphic here.

[00:08:53] Carla: No that’s fine. 

[00:08:55] Tamsin: Well babies will wee in the swimming pool. Yes, they will. And the nappies won’t stop that, but however, if they poo in the pool, we need it to be contained because otherwise you have to clean the pools down. So that’s really the purpose of the happy nappy, um, is to, to do that. Now, um, Splash About who are, sort of one of the leaders in this field of nappies. Have actually just bought out a nappy called a duo nappy. And actually it has that liner, that sort of cotton liner, um, in built into it. So you, you pay for one product which will last, you certainly for should be about three months, four months anyway. Um, and that will, that’s all you need as your basic starting point really. Um, so, uh, yes, have a look at, you know, Water Babies, um, have got them on our website, um, and Splash About and so forth. Um, are the, the nappies. Um, if you, um, if you then want to go a little bit further, you can get wetsuits for babies when they come swimming and you can get wet suits with the nappies built into them.

[00:09:57] Carla: Oh wow goodness. 

[00:09:59] Tamsin: So you can get things called happy nappy wetsuits. And in fact, there is now a duo nappy wetsuit as well. Um, which has the happy nappy is the base, but it has a covering for the upper part of the body. So covers the chest and the arms. Now babies cannot, uh, find it difficult to regulate their body temperatures be more honest. Until they’re about a year old, 11 months, a year old. So in, uh, particularly in the winter months, um, it’s worth looking at wet suits because they really do the jobs that they’re supposed to do and they keep the babies warm, just like an adult wetsuit will, will, and keep you warm if you’re wearing one.

[00:10:35] Um, and think about it. If you go swimming and you’re standing up in a swimming pool, sometimes you have a draft across your shoulders and so you duck down under the water to keep yourself warm well, babies experience the same thing, really. So that’s where the wet suits come in and are really, really useful, um, and will help to keep their body temperatures. Um, what I would say is that if you decide to use a wet suit, uh, you can put a wet suit onto a dry baby, but if you’ve been in the swimming pool and then you decide to put the wet suit on actually your baby’s body temperature has already dropped. So the wet suit really won’t do anything at all. So it’s better to start with a wet suit on and if you want to take it off, take it off, but not the other way round is how it works. 

[00:11:17] Carla: That’s interesting. And, and, um, with the wetsuits that you guys have an offer, do they start from new born or what age do they start from? 

[00:11:28] Tamsin: They start from newborn. So they start, well, actually newborn and then sort of nought to three months and then they go up, um, and you can get wet suits all the way up for all ages of children, actually. Um, the, the other thing that you can look at, um, so there are, as I say there is, um, a wetsuit which has the nappy built in, or you can buy things called wraps, which actually, um, go over the happy nappy and wrap, wrap around the body. Um, if your baby tends to grow is growing very fast, particularly in lengths. The, the wraps are great for that. Um, but they must be fitted tightly on their bodies like a, like an adult wetsuit, um, so that they, you know, it doesn’t matter if you’ve got a space at the top of the straps, but they need to fit around the body. The other thing that’s, um, is available in the market as well is a fleecy lined wetsuits.

[00:12:18] Carla: Oh, that sounds blooming great. I’d have one of them at home. 

[00:12:22] Tamsin: Well, they are like rash vests that you buy for children or adults wear rash vest when they swim and when they swim in cold water and they have a. Uh, kind of fleecy light liner. They don’t have any neoprene and them, because some, some children are allergic to neoprene so that they cover that problem. Um, and they, um, again, they work in terms of keeping the babies really warm, but they don’t have to fit tightly. They just keep the babies nice, nice and warm. So, um, I, you know, I would say for the tiny babies, the fleecy line ones are absolutely wonderful. They, they, again, they, they do the job that they’re supposed to do, um, and work, they’re very effective in what they do. Certainly. Some, I think some people are on the illusion or think that a sun vest or a sunsuit will work as, as a warm an outer warm net and they don’t, they, they are there purely for the sun. Um, and in, in, if you go swimming or you go on holiday or you’ve got paddling pools out in the summer, those are brilliant because the fabric is very, very finely woven so that they will actually, um, cut out the, the sun’s rays. Any, um, swimwear that you use in the summer, you should check that they are UVA, UVB, um, filters, you know, within the fabric. Uh, because again, they do that job really, really well. 

[00:13:38] Carla: That’s great advice. Brilliant. And if someone didn’t have potentially the money to splash out into a wetsuit straight away, what if they had a little girl or little boy, what should those children, what could those children get from say a supermarket that can they just get a normal swimsuit or? 

[00:13:56] Tamsin: Yes, they can. Um, and what I would say is if you were just going to take your little ones, swimming in the local swimming pool, um, you know, getting the paper nappies, uh, Or as I say, a cotton, uh, equivalent, and then to compare, give you an idea of prices. So a pack of, um, papers swim nappies from supermarkets are about £4.99, £5.99. Sometimes they’re on offer. Um, the cotton, uh, pants are, tend to be anything from £5.99 to £7.99 as just individual little pants. So. You know, if you’re, if you go swimming regularly, they’re going to last you longer. So they’re a better investment factor.

[00:14:34] Um, you’re happy nappies, are about £12, £12.50. The, the over nappies and the majority, I would think every swim school will insist on, on happy nappies being used. Um, the duo nappies I think, are on the market at the moment on the Splash About websites and so forth at about £16.50, £17. But bear in mind, they’ve got the liners built in. So again, Uh, you know, um, they will last, you certainly for 10, 12 weeks. Um, but otherwise, um, you should certainly have at least as your minimum with, with a baby, a paper nappy plus, um, you know, on the baby, really. And if you want to wear a swimsuit on top, you can certainly do that as well.

[00:15:16] Carla: That’s perfect. Thank you so much for that. So in regards to your Water Babies classes, your fantastic classes, how long are those sessions? 

[00:15:27] Tamsin: Um, so, uh, swimming lessons at Water Babies, our lessons are 30 minutes long. So you’re in the water for 30 minutes with your little one, and they are instructor led sessions, um, at water babies. And what we’re aiming to do is give you the parents skills so that you feel confident to go swimming with your little one, um, outside of the lessons as well. Um, now babies learn. They learn incredibly quickly, but small steps is probably the best way to describe it to you. Um, so we will repeat things. Um, we’ll, we’ll teach through play and through through songs, um, we’ll progress, um, activities as well, so that, uh, they’re learning, you know, step-by-step um, but we’re always go back over things. But we’re also teaching the parents as well, because, uh, they, they are our helpers in the water with their little ones. So it’s a learning, learning environment for them as well. Um, so that they move forward. Um, so that’s what you tend to find in formal lessons, some, some lessons, or you may find a more like play, just play sessions or free form play sessions where someone is there just to help if you’d like some help.

[00:16:34] Um, but as I say at Water Babies, we are instructor led and, um, we, we want you to have fun more than anything. It’s no good teaching, if we’re not all having fun together and the babies aren’t having fun because that’s how you learn. And the more enjoyment we get out of the lessons and you get out the lessons more, you’ll learn as we go forward.

[00:16:52] Carla: That’s that’s. Yeah, totally understand that. That’s great. And if you learning at the same time as having fun, brilliant. So in a Water Babies swim class then, is there a certain structure that you guys follow or is every teacher, um, owner of the franchise different? 

[00:17:09] Tamsin: Um, no, we have a program that stretches all across the country. I mean, you can find Water Babies offices, and Water Babies swimming lessons, I think virtually everywhere in the UK just about, I think, you know, the top of Snowdonia no, I don’t think we have quite got that far. 

[00:17:28] Carla: Next year. 

[00:17:28] Tamsin: But we do work to a structure and what we call schemes of work for the different age groups of the children. So, um, and we, the age groups are a guideline, um, and we know what the children should be able to achieve on land if you like at that age group. And then we adapt for, um, the watery environment. Now there are things that children can do in water, for example, that they may not be able to do on land. So if you think about it, something like propulsion in the water of lying on a wobble and kicking their legs. Um, they can lie on the floor and kick their legs, but actually in water that you’ve got the propulsive motion of going forward as well. So we, we know what they can achieve or what they they’re working to as land based on what we do is then adapt for water for water, really.

[00:18:13] Um, and the two work very much hand in hand. Um, so the fundamental skills that you have on land, we have fundamental skills to the water as well, really. So, yes. So you should find that, uh, uh, there are some similar content, different parts of the country. There may be some differences because we’re all individual teachers, we’re all individual people. And we will obviously teach the, uh, you know, we’ll teach as we are as a, as a person, certainly. But the generally the content and the outlines for the lessons are, um, where we’re working to the same sort of structure. Yep certainly. 

[00:18:47] Carla: That’s great. And, and so, um, of course I know they are fully safe for babies, but are the classes fully safe for babies at Water Babies?

[00:18:56] Tamsin: Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. Um, we, um, so one of the things we’re very proud of is the training that we give all our instructors. And I think sometimes people think it’s something that you can, you know, watch for a couple of hours and then teach. Um, if I said to you, it probably takes three months to train a Water Babies teacher.

[00:19:15] Carla: Wow.

[00:19:15] Tamsin: From start to finish. It’s a long, a long program. So we, we, we do what is known as a diploma, a level three diploma in, in baby swimming, mother and baby, parent to baby swimming. I should say not mother and baby swimming, cause we have lots and lots of daddies who come and grandparents who come as well. Um, and we do that under the guidance of Swim England the main swimming body here in the UK.

[00:19:37] And we do life-saving qualifications and safeguarding qualifications, um, all, all of those sorts of things, which we renew and update on a regular basis as well. Um, we send our new teachers away, um, to a course where they’re away for seven days, where they do masses of, uh, learning in a swimming pool. And we, uh, we teach them about uh, child development from birth through to the age of five, we talk about things like, um, what we call it in the industry, water wobbles. So when, when children go through the stage of separation from their parents, um, and learn their own identity, which is roundabout the age of one to 18 months, when they’re learning to walk.

[00:20:19] Um, and why that happens, why that happens as a process and why it’s so important that it happens. Um, because it’s all about learning about independence and the child realising that they’re their own little person that is really, really important. So we, we cover lots of things like that, the terrible twos, um, stages, um, when children will plateau, um, Almost like they’ve taken on too much information and they need to, um, absorb that information. So they may not. Um, so you may see it in swimming pools that they’re not progressing for a period of time. And then suddenly everything comes together. Um, and they progress. Um, these are all really normal things and they’re normal in the process of learning, not just in a swimming pool, but on dry land as well.

[00:21:05] Um, and one of the things I would say to any parents. Every single child is different. And every child learns at a different rate and you’ll see some children who, you know, one week they are holding onto the side of the pool and monkey down the side of the pool and a child of an equivalent age. Can’t do that. But then suddenly a couple of weeks later, they can do it. Um, so it’s all about the individual child and working with the individual child. So that’s really important in our teaching of our teachers, that they recognise that and teach what is in front of them. Um, and the expectation is not that the whole class will do X, Y and Z in this space of time. Really. 

[00:21:42] Carla: Yeah. Yeah. No, everyone goes, every child goes at their own speed don’t they? Really? So that makes sense. So what age can children go to Water Babies until? 

[00:21:54] Tamsin: Um, they can go to Water Babies until they’re about, uh, just over five, between five and six, um, that will depend on the, on the area and the swimming pools that we have. Um, to be honest with you, um, if you can imagine quite a lot of children by the time they’re five, they’re going to school well from four. Um, so you’ll find that we’ll be teaching the older children either after school hours or weekend classes. Um, so, uh, but yes, they can, they can, they can progress that far.

[00:22:21] Carla: Yes, that’s fantastic. And what age have you seen children swimming safely on their own if they’ve started the beginning of their, I suppose their life really? 

[00:22:31] Tamsin: Well. If I say to you that I, I have a, um, uh, a six month old, five months old who can float on her own?

[00:22:38] Carla: What? Oh my goodness. Wow. 

[00:22:43] Tamsin: To swim on their own, you really are looking at so, so the children will swim under water and they’ll swim short distances underwater, um, from a young age, generally about 18 months /2 to actually as long as they’re, they’re happy and they’re confident. Um, swimming on their own on the surface. Yes. About 2 and a half. Um, they may not have strokes or perfect strokes. Um, but they may be, um, you know, they can get from A to B. Um, and they, uh, one of the things I think that, um, is, is just its magic. It’s just magic to watch actually is how strong these children are. Um, So if you’ve had it, if you’re, if you swum with Water Babies from tiny and you know, your child can climb out to the swimming pool at 18 months old, thats normal for that child, they don’t know any different.

[00:23:31] And it’s not until you see another child who hasn’t done that, that you suddenly realize actually, my child is my child is brilliant and they are physically very strong. And some of those things you’ll then see in later life to how strong those children are. Um, I was talking to a mum recently of, uh, um, he’s not a little boy anymore. He’s 15 actually. And, um, he, he sails, um, he goes sailing and he loves sailing and he’s doing really well with his sailing. But she said you know, he is phenomenally strong. He can go out in high winds and the, you know, the adult instructors have said to him what, you know, he’s just amazing. He can control the sails and winds that you, you just wouldn’t expect at the age of that he is. Um, and I think a lot of that, she puts it down to him starting so young. I’ll be really honest with you. My daughter, who is now in her twenties, um, she learnt dive so scuba dive at the age of 12 and when she first started, the instructors were saying, you know, you’ll go down and you’ll use up all the air in your tank.

[00:24:36] Um, probably in about five minutes, 10 minutes, and then you’ll be back up to the surface. And that’s quite normal because you’re, you know, you may be panicking. Well, 15 minutes later, the instructor still hasn’t come up with her. And when he comes up, he says, she’s only used half a tank, um, my daughter started at five weeks old. So, you know, she has this phenomenal lung capacity. 

[00:24:56] Carla: That’s incredible. I mean, even, I mean, obviously it’s important to swim all year round, but I think the time that a lot of parents it highlights, how important is, is is those summer months when, you know, you might be going on holiday or you might be going around water and it’s just that nerve wracking feeling, isn’t it like, oh, what if my child fell in? Or what if this happened? What if that happened? I know I get a lot of these kinds of visions in my mind before we’re going on holiday and, and it’s just a worrying being around water, but having the confidence to know that your child is a safe around water must be absolutely amazing at such a young age.

[00:25:33] Tamsin: Yes, absolutely. And I would never, you know, with small children, I would never advocate leaving them on their own near water at all, but teaching them to respect water, um, and understanding, um, that’s, that’s, you know, it’s an environment in which they need to be sensible. At, you know, a child who, um, is frightened of falling into, into a pool or falling into the river is more likely to panic. And the last thing we need them to do is panic, because when you panic in water, that is where you’re more likely to drown. Um, we’ve had these terrible situations over the last couple of years where people have gone swimming because the weather has been so good and, and have drowned, which is just so tragic.

[00:26:13] Um, so teaching children to, you know, if they fell in. To actually react by reaching out and, you know, to hold onto something or floating on their back. Well, if it gives them 20 seconds, it’s 20 seconds more, but actually you’ve got time to, you know, to get in and, and get and get them out. Um, so all of those things we cover safety is a big factor in, in the Water Babies program. And from very early on, we teach safety skills. Um, the children don’t you know, at the age of a year, they don’t realize that their safety skills, but actually, um, their reactions to things they’re naturally, if they’re falling, we’ll turn around and start holding onto the side and doing things like that, which is what we want them to do.

[00:26:54] And, and, uh, and learn that that is important. So as I say, it’s very much about respect and supervising children. Um, and later on with our sort of three year olds, four year olds. Really, we do teach them some basic life skills. So understanding that if you’re going to try and help someone who may have fallen and you lie down in your tummy, um, and, and, you know, or, um, throw a reaching pole to them or, um, identifying the flags on the beach. So, you know, the children can identify where, where it’s safe to swim. So that they can you know, bring those sorts of things up and understand, you know, what that means. And if their parents are saying, well, you can’t swim here because the flag is saying, no, they understand why they can’t swim. So yeah, lots of things like that are covered in the lessons.

[00:27:37] Carla: So there’s so many benefits really, because not only are you bonding with your baby and, and all that, it’s also the safety side as well. And, and that’s something that. You know, um, my mum, we didn’t really go to swimming lessons and I’ve always been a bit scared of water and I would never want that for my child. You know, it’s that, that, that’s just amazing that you cover all that. And also obviously there’s going to be mental health benefits. Isn’t that really? Um, so can you talk a bit about those? 

[00:28:04] Tamsin: Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. I will say to you, Carla, I had a really bad experience as a child and, and actually that’s what started me down the route of setting up Water Babies and take, because I said my children would never be scared of water. Um, I had a swimming teacher, the age of five, who used to duck you underwater, um, as you were swimming along with a float, because she said, you know, it’s important. You understood. That that’s what happened. And even today now if someone jumped on me in the swimming pool. I think they might, might get it a little bit of a, you know, me reacting to that. So I completely understand where you’re coming from and that’s the last thing in the world I want. Um, I think, um, you know, swimming is, uh, is, uh, is activity, a physical activity and lots of researchers now showing how important it is that, um, that children, but adults as well, do physical activity to help with their mental health.

[00:29:03] And, um, I think, you know, being able to, you know, pregnant mums, um, spending going and sitting in a swimming pool or swimming up and down a swimming pool, very gently. It can really, really help balance you. It can really, really help bring down any anxieties and concerns and worries. Um, and I would say it’s back to that whole thing about bringing swimming in as being part of your fitness, um, attitudes within your family really. Um, so. There is, you know, there’s lots of, there’s a lot of research being done at the moment about pregnant women. If they are very anxious during their pregnancies, there is a high chance that anxiety will be part of their children’s lives as well. So if we can look after and go back to that stage when parents are, you know, when mums are pregnant, I should say, um, and help them in that sort of situation. I think that’s a really important factor. And bringing, you know, when it comes to their children, their babies and they’re new parents for the first time, looking after them and giving them the reassurance and making them feel safe in the pool is as important for the parent, as it is for the child. Um, if you feel safe, then you will relax.

[00:30:12] And one of the things that, again, a lot of research is showing is that if the parents are relaxed in the swimming pool, they create, uh, all the positive, lovely, oxytocin hormones that we need. Um, and that passes through to their children. So again the children will relax and be safe, um, within that swimming pool or feel, feel happy, I should say, within that swimming pool really.

[00:30:34] Um, so any activity, whether it is swimming, walking, jogging, anything like that is very good for your mental health. And we certainly would like to see, um, you know parents doing those activities with their children from a very young age so that the children start that off. Um, I heard a really interesting concept the other day, um, about thinking about your life as being a little bit like the jam jar and, um, for people who suffer from anxiety. And actually, if you fill the jam jar, you put sand in the bottom and fill it with water. If you’re feeling very anxious, if you associate that jam jar with your life, is it becoming full and everything is getting on top of you? Um, whereas actually, if you think about it as the sediment at the bottom is your genetics and what you’re made up of, um, you’ve got that. That’s part of you, but then if you actually think about the water as being all the things around you that make you happy. So your family, your friends, maybe your job, if you really love your job, um, the hobbies that you have. Um, the activities that you do, actually, your jam jar is getting fuller and fuller, of all the really nice positive things in this world.

[00:31:42] Um, and I think, um, you know, I, that’s a good, good way of thinking about for your children, fill that, fill their jam jars with all those lovely, positive things. 

[00:31:51] Carla: That is so nice. And, and finally, um, Tamsin, would you tell us a little bit about the benefits of continuing swimming like through the whole year? Because I know a lot of parents will start it in summer time and then, you know, it gets to winter time and then it gets a bit cold and it’s easy to kind of stop, but what are the benefits of carrying it on all year? 

[00:32:15] Tamsin: Well, so swimming all the way through the year. Um, First it’s the continuity. So it’s repeating and building on what you’ve done before. So there’s continuity, like anything that we do, the more we do it, the better we get at it. Um, and the faster we learn. So that’s, you know, the basics really of doing that. Um, there’s a lot of, um, talk about during the winter months, you know, the children get cold, they might catch colds. Um, they may get colds from the swimming pools, um, wet hair, um, makes, gives them colds. Lots of things like that, which actually they’re all, if I’m honest with you, they’re all myths. Um, we, we all catch colds because we come into contact with someone else who has got a cold or they’ve recently, um, you know, you can catch the cold from a supermarket trolley, for example. Um, and I would say in this world of pandemic, we that’s become very apparent, apparent to us.

[00:33:07] Um, so you know, other viruses work in that way as well. Swimming through the winter months is really good because it gives you routine. It gives you continuity. They help with mental health. Certainly. Um, it also, um, it, it means that you’re, you’re doing a physical activity. Generally the, you know, the swimming pools we use are warm, um, and the changing rooms, um, you know, your indoors, when you get changed, um, wearing a hat when you leave the pool and putting a hat on a baby is a good thing to do because we lose heat from our heads. But that’s just like wrapping up to go outside anyway, fresh air is good for us. Um, so getting out and about is really good for us. Um, even if it’s, you know, uh a, walk out in the countryside again, that’s, that is really important for us. So keeping that continuity going is, is great. It means that we’re doing some physical activity, um, and it means that it keeps our mind happy, happy, and healthy, and our body happy and healthy as well. And that’s the same for babies just as, as is. For us as adults as well. 

[00:34:08] Carla: That’s brilliant. Gosh. Oh, you’ve Tamsin you’ve gone through so much. It’s it’s amazing, honestly. Um, thank you so, so much. Can you tell parents where they can find you and Water Babies?

[00:34:23] Tamsin: Absolutely. Um, so if, if you’d like to know more about water babies lessons, um, and even if you just want to talk to someone who knows something about swimming, um, and I hope you can tell I’m very passionate about this. Um, have a look at our website, which has all the W’s Um, and you’ll find, um, a website where you can put your postcode in and will, and it will link you to your nearest, um, pools and offices. Um, and your starting points. You’ll find us all on social media. So we have a main Water Babies, a Facebook site, um, and, uh, our local offices, um, also have, uh, the pages linked to that and we have, uh, groups for all our mummies and daddies. So for me, um, I’m Water Babies Bucks and Beds, and you’ll find me on Facebook as Water Babies Milton Keynes, North Hampton and Bedfordshire. So I would love you to come and join us. And as I say, any questions, feel free to ask us, that’s what we’re here for. 

[00:35:17] Carla: Well, you certainly know, you know, your stuff Tamsin anyway and you can hear how passionate you are about it, which is absolutely amazing. So thank you so much for coming on today’s podcast. 

[00:35:28] Tamsin: Well, thank you, Carla. It’s been an absolute delight and really, really enjoyed it. Being able to share, um, you know, the subject I am very passionate about. Definitely. 

[00:35:36] Carla: Thank you. Take care. 

[00:35:39] Thank you for listening to My Bump 2 Baby’s Expert podcast. If you would like to find help and support from experts in your local area, head over to and you will also be able to find local pregnancy to preschool groups, classes, businesses, and services in your local area.

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Maternity Leave Mortgages Thu, 04 Nov 2021 10:39:27 +0000 Do you have a question about mortgages on maternity leave?

In today’s expert podcast we invite expert Lorraine Collie from Zing mortgages to answer all your questions about mortgages and maternity leave.

The post Maternity Leave Mortgages appeared first on MyBump2Baby Podcasts.

  • Maternity Leave Mortgages

Do you have a question about mortgages on maternity leave?

In today’s expert podcast we invite expert Lorraine Collie from Zing mortgages to answer all your questions about mortgages and maternity leave.

We discuss mortgage holidays during maternity leave, re-mortgaging on maternity leave, family protection on maternity leave and how to get on the property ladder with bad credit and steps you can take today.

[00:00:00] Carla: My Bump 2 Baby is one of the UK’s leading parenting platforms. You can find local pregnancy to preschool groups, classes, and lessons, wherever you are in the UK. Not only that, but you can read our honest reviews on the latest products, days out and services that you as parents need to know about. We also work with trusted financial advisors, family law, solicitors, and now estate agents, too. If you would like to find your nearest trusted expert, head over to

[00:00:46] Are you a parent looking to start a small business, perhaps you’ve no idea where to start? Or maybe you’ve already got a small business and you’re struggling to take it to that next level. My Bump 2 Baby is here to support you. My Bump 2 Baby business offers training packages, mentorship programs, one-to-one support, and e-courses, if you would like more information on how to grow your business with My Bump 2 Baby. Then email us. Our email address is

[00:01:35] Hello, and welcome to my Bump 2 Baby Expert podcast, where we bring experts from all over the UK to answer your questions on everything, pregnancy to preschool.

[00:01:59] Today. I am speaking to Lorraine Collie from Zing Mortgages in Bishop’s Stortford. And today we’re going to be talking all about mortgages on maternity leave. All your questions will be answered hopefully within this podcast. I hope you enjoy it.

[00:02:21] Hello everybody. And welcome to my Bump 2 Baby’s Expert podcast. Today, we are talking about a very important subject, maternity leave mortgages, everything you need to know about having a mortgage on maternity leave. And today I am joined by expert Lorraine Collie, who is our mortgage protection specialist in Bishop’s Stortford.

[00:02:47] Hi Lorraine. How are you? 

[00:02:49] Lorraine: Hi, Carla I’m great thanks how are you? 

[00:02:52] Carla: I’m very well thank you very well. So I’m really looking forward to talking to you on this subject. I actually am pregnant at the moment, so finding it very, very interesting finding out about how it works with maternity leave and mortgages. Um, so I’m looking forward to this, this chat, but do you want to introduce yourself Lorraine? Tell us a bit about you? 

[00:03:14] Lorraine: Yeah. And congratulations on your pregnancy. So I’m Lorraine, I’m a mortgage and protection advisor. I work for a company called Zing Mortgages, work from home, always did sort of base myself at home anyway. So I was kind of ahead of the pandemic in that instance. We work, a lot of the time at the minute is remotely, but we can do house visits if people are comfortable with that. Some people like, you know, have face-to-face contact still and that’s absolutely fine. So I do do face-to-face contact as well as, zoom appointments and telephone calls. It’s such a sensitive subject when you’re talking about people’s finances so often, they find it a bit more comfortable in their own homes.

[00:03:59] So I’ve been doing this for about three years now. And really enjoy it. I love watching people grow. You know, I’ve seen them go from buying their first house to the families coming along and then moving and upgrading and making sure that every step of the way they’re covered or if they, any unexpected surprises that come along that life like to throw at you. So we offer them insurance packages as well to make sure that you’re covered in the event of that happening. 

[00:04:29] Carla: That’s really good. No, that’s great. Um, cause I know you also cover the protection side of things as well don’t you?

[00:04:38] Lorraine: Yeah, protections a huge part of what I do. Cause I believe in it’s so much, you know we insure our homes, we insure our cars, even our mobile phones, but people forget about themselves and often you find it’s not until, somebody has a baby that it becomes, oh, right, this is, this is serious what’s going to happen if I can’t work, if my partner can’t work, you know, or the death of either one of you, you’ve all these scenarios going through your head.

[00:05:06] And it’s so important to make sure that you’re prepared so that if you do end up in that situation, you’re covered and it’s one less thing to worry about. So obviously when we’re starting out with first time buyers, we’ll look at covering your income if you’re unable to work. I mean, we’ve seen from the pandemic that people really struggled on 80% of their wages.

[00:05:27] Um, and, hadn’t really thought about it before. So we’re doing a lot of income protection at the moment where people are covering their income in the event of long-term sickness, meaning that their mortgages are still affordable. Also, um, life insurance to cover the mortgage on the death of either partner or yourself. Meaning the mortgage is completely paid off and also critical illness, critical illness, you know, one in two of us get cancer in our lifetime and it’s the most claimed on insurance site of them all. So at a time like that, the last thing you want to be doing is worrying about finances. So putting something in place to cover your mortgage and outgoings in that event is also really important. So we’ll kind of do an overhaul of your scenario how much, you know, we think you can live on, what your budget is each month, things that, yeah okay won’t need to include that. Cause that’s not a necessity and work to your, to tailor it to your personal needs.

[00:06:31] Carla: Absolutely. Yeah. I think what you’ve mentioned there, I think there’s a lot more people that are very open-minded when it comes to protection, because they’ve actually seen it firsthand what can happen if they can’t work. It’s so important. And I think something else I want to touch on while we’re talking about this, is a lot of people, you know, can think, oh, I’ll go online and just get it online. And it’s cheap and cheerful, et cetera. But, um, you know, I, I’ve known a lot of people that have actually gone to claim on insurance’s, and actually they’ve not been covered for what they thought. So that’s why, you know at My Bump 2 Baby, we think it’s really important to, to actually speak to a professional in the local area who knows you and can actually review the policy properly.

[00:07:16] Lorraine: Yeah. This is it, I mean, you know, shopping online is so popular at the minute, that a lot of people are doing it. But would you then go buy a car in Tesco, you know, no you would want advice on which car to get, what’s going to meet your needs. So definitely speaking to an expert. And there’s so many products available now, that you might not necessarily be getting the right one for you. Often there’s a misconception where people think. That they want to insure their life in the event of death, but actually you’re more likely to use a critical illness policy than you are a death policy, because you’re less likely to die within the term of your mortgage, but you are likely to be critically ill. So it’s about, you know, somebody knowing your circumstances, and knowing where there are gaps in that to cover you.

[00:08:08] There’s a really good policy as well called family income benefit. And this pays out on death. Obviously, you know, if you cover your mortgage, that thats paid off, but then how do you work? You know, often you’ve got lot of mums at home and one wage families. If that wage was to disappear. How do you survive? So we look at things like that as well. So we look at family income policy that would cover that wage on the event, in the event of death, meaning you’re covered all angles. So there’s a lot of things that people don’t think about. And again, it’s just, its about getting the best isn’t it? There’s no point in paying a monthly premium for something that’s not going to cover you if you were to be in that position.

[00:08:51] Carla: Exactly. And I think that’s a mistake a lot of people come back and they’ll say, oh, I made a mistake with that because they might’ve set it up 10 years ago. And it was obviously, you know, the younger you are, the cheaper it is, isn’t it a lot of the time. And then they’ve set it up and they’ve been paying into something that actually. Might not have paid out or it’s not actually suitable for their needs. And then it comes to that time and claiming, and it’s like, oh God, God, I’ve paid. It’s a double hit actually, because you’ve paid for it. And you’re not actually able to claim on it for some people. So, so it’s really, really important just to make sure that everything you know, is covered and your covered the best, best for you really. It’s not about kind of spending an absolute fortune. You, you do what you can afford, but it’s a case of making sure your family is protected should the worst happen. And unfortunately, there’s so many circumstances, the worst does happen. We all know someone that’s passed away young and you know, it’s, it is really sad. So, so that is, is something that’s really important. 

[00:09:51] Lorraine: Exactly. And when you touch on age there as well, you know, I deal with a lot of first time buyers and each time I’m like, please take some protection because you’re so young know that it’s really cheap. You’re going to come back to me in 10 years time with a wife and a baby, and you’re going to want insurance and it’s going to be triple the price. Because unfortunately it will go up each year. You know, your age does go against you when, when it comes to insurance. So it’s so important that you think about it and do it as early as you can to save yourself in the long term.

[00:10:24] Carla: Absolutely. So with the maternity leave mortgages. So with that, if someone is thinking of applying for a mortgage. But they’re going on maternity or they’re on maternity, and they’ve seen their dream house. Can they get that mortgage or not? 

[00:10:40] Lorraine: Yeah. So the lenders don’t discriminate against people going on maternity leave, obviously they all have a different view on it. There’s so much criteria surrounding it. Um, and they all, they’re all very different. But overall, um, the, some lenders will want to, will work on your last payslip before you went on maternity. They may request a return to work letter, to confirm that your due to return to work on the same terms and the same conditions, same hours, et cetera. And they’ll take that and they will use your full pay. Other lenders if you are on statutory maternity pay rather than, you know, full maternity pay. They might like to see a bit of savings, to prove that you can cover yourself for that year, while you’re out of work. So it’s not, it’s not a no, but there are different criteria’s with the various lenders. So again, it’s about speaking to someone in the know, so you can find one that fits with your circumstances.

[00:11:39] Carla: That’s great. So what would someone do if they’re on maternity leave and the partner’s got a full-time wage, but between them they’re really struggling to pay their mortgage. What are their options? 

[00:11:52] Lorraine: So with struggling to pay your mortgage. The first thing you’ve got to do is speak to your lender. It’s so important that you alert them immediately and don’t just stop paying it. When you speak to them, they can, there is various options that they have available to you depending on your circumstances. So they may give you a payment holiday. They may switch you to an interest only for a while. Which will lower your payments and make it more affordable for you. But speak to them because they are human and we’ve all seen again from the pandemic that they did offer payment holidays, then, you know, they were behind, their clients when it was, when they were in a difficult situation. So, um, always speak to them in the first instance and gain the help that you need. 

[00:12:36] Carla: That’s great advice. And, and during maternity leave, by being on maternity leave, does that affect future mortgages or is that just something they take into account? And that happens because people do have babies. 

[00:12:49] Lorraine: Yeah. So it won’t necessarily affect your future mortgages. I mean, if you’re going to return to work on the same terms and the same income, then you’re not going to be affected at all. If, for instance, you were return on part-time, so you’re not earning as much, then the next time you go to purchase the affordability won’t be as high as it was previously. 

[00:13:08] Carla: Right. Okay. That makes sense. And, and remortgaging, I assume that’s the same with buying a new property on, on maternity leave. You can’t, they won’t discriminate you against that. Is that right? 

[00:13:20] Lorraine: No. So again, it will go back to the criteria where they’ll assess the situation. They’ll either take your last pay slip from pre maternity and return to work letter. And then remortgage you from there. If you’re looking for extra borrowing again, the affordability will be assessed based on your new income. If you’re going to go back part-time or your full-time income, if that’s how you’re returning. So it’s really specific to everybody’s individual needs.

[00:13:49] Carla: Right. Okay. And, what about if you’re on maternity leave and you’re self-employed how does that work? Does that, is that a fairly similar, similar process? 

[00:13:59] Lorraine: Yeah, so with self-employed, um, it’s been really difficult because the lenders always worked off last years accounts and obviously when Covid happened they realised that hold on a second, we’re working off 2019 accounts but they might not have earned anything in 2020. So they’ve, they’ve kind of changed their criteria slightly whereby with self-employed they look at your accounts, but they also look at your business bank statements to see what sort of income you’ve had over the last three months. And then annualise. Um, to see if you’re in line to earn, what you’re you were earning.

[00:14:37] So it would work similar with maternity leave. And again, if you’re self-employed and not earning anything, but you do have this statutory maternity pay, they would use either that income or if you did have savings to back it up, then they would say, okay, yet if you’ve got a good track record, self-employed okay. We believe that when you returned to work. You’ll maintain the same income going forward. So they would look at it that way. So again, just down to each lender and finding the best lender for your situation. 

[00:15:07] Carla: And do you work with a few lenders then Lorraine? 

[00:15:11] Lorraine: Yeah so we’ve got access to over 150 lenders in our panel and we’ve good working relationships with them as well. So often when, as part of the research we would speak to individual lenders directly, we put scenarios out to the lenders and say, does this fit with you? How, can we make this work? So yeah, we build relationships with the various lenders and get to do their criteria inside out. Although it’s changed so much over the last year, it was really difficult to keep up. But we do have, we were bombarded with emails daily about changes to criteria. So we really, are as up to date as we can be, and we’re able to find out who’s best for what situation very, very quickly as well. 

[00:15:55] Carla: Thats great. And can you help people that have had debts previously, um, as well where they’re not really sure if they could quite get a mortgage, but they’d like to try?

[00:16:07] Lorraine: Yeah, I see. I’m seeing quite a lot of this at the minute where people are often afraid to come forward. Oh my friend told me, I can’t get a mortgage because I’ve got a default CCJ, whatever it may be. And thats total false information. This is where you really need to speak to an expert so that we can guide you through where you need to be. So it’s not necessarily a no, there our specialist lenders, that deal with people who’ve been in financial difficulty previously and will consider you, will consider your application. That might be reflected in the rates. But if it gets you where you want to be, you know, then it can be done. So again, it’s about speaking to someone who knows what they’re dealing with when it comes to that, and not been afraid to. We’ve all been there, you know, we’ve all been there were, we’ve got ourself financial difficulty, whether it be when we were young and silly or, you know, when we were older and suddenly things have just gone on top of us, you know, so don’t be afraid to come forward and speak and get help.

[00:17:09] You know, that’s the best thing to. And even if we can’t, even if we can’t do anything right now, we can put a plan in place. So often what I find with customers that have been impacted is, okay, I can’t help you at the minute, but in six months time, this is an option in 12 months time, this is an option. So then we can keep in touch and kind of maintain their credit report in the meantime, and work with them to get them to where they want to be. So I do, got a lot about the minute, especially with first-time buyers who are struggling with their credit, whereby i’ll just do three monthly phone calls with them to check in, see how the deposits going and see how their credit report is looking and keep in touch with them up until the point where we’re ready to move forward.

[00:17:57] Carla: That’s a great service that, because I think, I think a lot of, I mean, gosh, I’ve done it myself, um, years ago when you were at college and you know, you’re 18 and you go into the bank and they say, oh, do you want a credit card? You like, yeah. And it just feels like free money at the time. And you know, a lot of us have been there and. Um, when I, when I used to work in a bank. A lot of the people working behind the desk were actually targeted to sell you credit cards and stuff like that. So, so, you know, and it put a lot of people in situations where, you know, they, they might think they can’t get that mortgage. So I love that you said that, that don’t be afraid to come forward, because I think some people are very embarrassed about that. And, you know, you certainly not on your own, um, with that and, and making those mistakes, you know, So it’s, you know, a lot of people have done it. 

[00:18:49] Lorraine: Yeah. My downfall was store cards, you know, when you’re going into Topshop in Oxford street at 18, and they’re offering you a bit of plastic to put all these clothes on, you know, it’s hard to resist, but it’s all a learning curve as well, you know? And it can, it can be fixed. You know, you can just work towards getting yourself out of that situation. 

[00:19:11] Carla: Yeah, definitely. And some people as well who have kind of got themselves in these situations when they were maybe 18 and now they’re 30 something and they’re still too afraid to find out about getting a mortgage. I you know, I just want to reiterate, you know, get in touch with Lorraine, because it might be that she’ll be able to do something for you. And like she said, you know, a bit of a plan in place. If not, don’t be embarrassed by it. 

[00:19:36] Lorraine: Yeah, certainly. Unfortunately, because of the world that we’re living in at the minute, there is a lot of people who have been in financial difficulty over the last year, um, you know, are kind of trying to get themselves out of it at the minute. So definitely speak to someone, don’t sit and panic about it or listen to somebody in the pub who tells you one thing, you know, speak to an expert. And then that way you can put a plan in place to sort it all out. 

[00:20:01] Carla: That’s brilliant. That’s brilliant. And, and, um, also then if, if someone is thinking of getting a buy to let, perhaps during maternity and they’ve saved up money, obviously I think a bigger deposit needs to go down on those or is that different for each lender again? 

[00:20:18] Lorraine: Yeah, it can vary the buy-to-let mortgages. Generally, you’re looking at by a 25% deposit, however, there are some lenders that will offer a 20% deposit and again, based around your circumstances. So if you are on maternity leave and you’re looking for your first, buy-to-let then thats assessed slightly differently, because if you’re a first-time landlord, they want to ensure that you’ve got funds in place to cover any rental voids. However, once you go on and you’re purchasing a second or third buy-to-let they’ll then work off the rental income. So the first buy-to-let, just is a little bit more intense in affordability. Cause they want to know that you’d able to cover it basically, but once, you’re on the, the buy-to-let ladder, and you’re you have numinous properties then they tend to work on the rental income.

[00:21:08] Carla: Oh, wow. That’s really good. And, um, you can, if you’ve got a business, like we spoke about a bit further back. If you’re on maternity leave and you’ve got a business and you, and you went, um, you opted for buy to let there are ways around that that are fully legal around tax efficiency, that they can do it as well isn’t there?

[00:21:28] Lorraine: Yeah, So you can purchase property in a limited company as well. So special vehicles, as well can be used to purchase properties so that you’re not liable for them. Um, so yeah, that’s something to discuss with your accountant, if you’re thinking about a buy-to-let property, discuss with, your accountant how they think is best for your tax situation.

[00:21:51] Carla: That’s great. So Lorraine then, um, just, just to finish off I know i’ve, we’ve gone through quite a bit there, but I think that’s really useful. Everything that we’ve covered there. Oh, one thing I did want to ask is it about protection, during maternity leave. I know we kind of covered protection, but I don’t think a lot of people are, are aware. They can actually get protection whilst they’re pregnant? 

[00:22:15] Lorraine: Yeah. And often you find it’s when you’re in that situation of becoming pregnant that you start thinking about all these different scenarios. So yeah, absolutely you can, and you can insure yourself for as much and as little as you want, we can tailor the insurance to your budget as well. So it might not be possible to get you as much as what you know, you, you should have in place say. But we can tailor that to your budget. So come to me with a budget and we can work round that and figure out where the biggest gap is in your life for protection. And we can work with that. So, yeah, it’s definitely about putting a plan in place for yourself. Think about how much you would need. I mean it’s awful to think about death, and things like that. But it’s a conversations thats so important because you don’t want to be in that situation and then have that worry on your shoulders. So just think about your budget, what you can afford to live on, you know, what you would need in the event of the worst happening.

[00:23:14] Carla: Yeah, exactly. And also, you know, think for yourself, but also your partner, if your partner was unable to work for any reason anymore, could you actually you know, pay that mortgage. Could you continue making those payments? You know, when you’re off on maternity leave, obviously statutory maternity is, is quite low. If something was to happen, you know, are your covered?

[00:23:37] Lorraine: Yeah. This is like statutory maternity pay is £151.20 a week for 39 weeks. So that’s not a lot of money, but when you’re, you know, are in that planning stage of. You know, you find out you’re pregnant and you think, right. Okay. I’m going to have six or nine months off work. It’s always good to work on a budget and write it down. And I actually heard something really interesting last week and it was about having money dates. So we all go out on date night, but have a money date where you sit down and you discuss your money and where it’s going and what you want to achieve. So whether thats saving for your pension, you know, have a think about what you want in retirement and how you’re going to get there and discuss that openly. And also another thing they suggested was discuss that around your children so that your children are, then able to know about money because obviously we’re living in a plastic world at the minute where everything is paid on card. And kids I find are not getting, are not understanding the value for money.

[00:24:42] So it’s really important to open up that conversation and have it with them, um, as well, so that they are aware of yeah if you save up x amount of money, you can get here, or what would you like to achieve? You know whether it’s just some toy that they are after. Let them save gradually and see the growth in money. And how, what you can achieve from doing that. But yeah writing it down is always best.

[00:25:06] Carla: That’s great. It’s funny you say that actually me and my husband do, do do that and go through everything. And it is, is a case of just kind of keeping on top of things really, because you can be paying for things and, and you haven’t used them for so long, so really, really important to do. And also, like you said about the children actually made me giggle a little bit. My, my son has just handed me, um, a letter for Father Christmas. And I think it’s got listed on every single Smyth’s toy going. So he doesn’t know the value of money. I was like listed you can only have one, no, Santa brings everything. I thought this is just brilliant. So, so yeah, having a, having a clear, clear chat with you with your little ones about money, I obviously need to do that more is, is important. 

[00:25:51] Lorraine: Yeah. So, so actually, when you’re talking about Santa and money apparently, for every pound that the toy costs, it takes an elf a minute to make. So they can’t have really expensive toys. Cause the elves don’t have enough minutes to make all those expensive toys. 

[00:26:08] Carla: Oh, yes. I didn’t think of that. So I will be, uh, I’ll be reporting that back later. Thank you for that. If someone wanted to get in touch with you, you currently are offering free advice aren’t you. 

[00:26:20] Lorraine: Yeah. So the initial conversation is all at my own costs because I want to know that I’m able to help you before we charge a fee. So I’ll be speaking to clients for two years before I have had a penny out of them, you know. We put all this plan in place and we don’t charge anything until the point of mortgage application. So at that stage, you would have found a house, offer been accepted, and you’re ready to go ahead and start the mortgage. And it’s at that stage that we charge our fees. So if you just want to discuss something, you know, you want to discuss bad credit, buy-to-lets anything like that. Then please feel free to contact me and we can have a chat about it. 

[00:26:59] Carla: That’s brilliant. Lorraine, would you mind just telling people where they can find you and how they, how they are best contacting you at the moment?

[00:27:07] Lorraine: Yeah, so I can be found on Facebook Lorraine Collie Zing Mortgages and, or you can contact me via phone or my email address, which I believe is on the advert is that right? 

[00:27:19] Carla: It is, and I’ll pop all those details on the bottom of this podcast as well. So anyone that’s listened to this, if you just want to kind of scroll down. You’ll be able to see all of Lorraine’s details there. So you can make contact with her right away. Yeah. I highly recommend you speak to Lorraine and she will be able to help you with everything that we’ve discussed. So thank you so much. 

[00:27:39] Lorraine: Thanks for having me, Carla. 

[00:27:40] Carla: Thank you. 

[00:27:44] Thank you for listening to My Bump 2 Baby’s Expert podcast. If you would like to find help and support from experts in your local area, head over to and you will also be able to find local pregnancy to preschool groups, classes, businesses, and services in your local area.

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The Benefits of Cloth Nappies Wed, 13 Oct 2021 17:16:14 +0000 Today Carla speaks with Lianne from Green Cheeks about cloth nappies. Lianne answers all of our burning questions about cloth nappies including; What cloth nappies are, when you can start using them, how many you need to get started, the benefits of cloth nappies, how to wash cloth nappies and how often they need to be changed.

The post The Benefits of Cloth Nappies appeared first on MyBump2Baby Podcasts.

  • The Benefits of Cloth Nappies

Today Carla speaks with Lianne from Green Cheeks about cloth nappies. Lianne answers all of our burning questions about cloth nappies including; What cloth nappies are, when you can start using them, how many you need to get started, the benefits of cloth nappies, how to wash cloth nappies and how often they need to be changed. 

[00:00:00] Carla: This podcast is sponsored by My Bump 2 Baby family protection and legal directory. To find your nearest advisor or family law, solicitor, head over to

[00:00:29] Hello and welcome to My Bump 2 Baby Expert Podcast, where we bring experts from all over the UK. To answer your questions on everything pregnancy to preschool

[00:00:52] Today we invite on Lianne Stevenson from Green Cheeks Cloth Nappies, and Lianne is going to be answering all of our questions about what cloth nappies. I hope you enjoy this episode. 

[00:01:08] Hello everybody. And welcome to My Bump 2 Baby’s Expert Podcast. Today I am joined by the lovely Lianne Stevenson, the owner of Green Cheeks Cloth Nappies. Hi Lianne how are you?

[00:01:23] Lianne: I’m fine. Thank you. How are you?

[00:01:25] Carla: I’m good thank you. It’s actually quite sunny outside. So I’m quite happy today. 

[00:01:29] Lianne: Yeah, rogue sunny day. 

[00:01:32] Carla: Exactly. In October. It’s quite a nice, nice, a nice thing to wake up to. So we’re going to be today talking all around cloth nappies. Cause I know a lot of parents are curious, but they’re just not quite sure of the process. I mean, I am definitely one of those parents, so, um, so I’ve got a few questions that, um, other people have sent in. So are we okay to get started with those? 

[00:01:59] Lianne: Absolutely. 

[00:02:00] Carla: Perfect. So Lianne, first of all, tell us what cloth nappies actually are?

[00:02:07] Lianne: So a cloth nappy is a nappy that you don’t throw away. So it is a reusable nappy. Um, there are literally hundreds of different brands and probably 10 different types of cloth nappy that are out there in existence. But the principles all the same, it’s some sort of absorbent fabric, with a waterproof layer on the outside, is the gist of it, um, so nappy changing time, rather than bagging it up and throwing it away, you will store it in a bag or a bucket and wash it and start over again.

[00:02:42] Carla: So it’s definitely more eco-friendly to do it that way. 

[00:02:45] Lianne: Absolutely.

[00:02:46] Carla: So in terms of cloth nappies, when can you actually start using them? Would you use them from birth or would you wait a little while?

[00:02:54] Lianne: So personally, I waited a while. I started that about eight weeks. Um, well, first time, new mum, absolutely clueless about motherhood in general. Getting into breastfeeding? So, um, I would say if you, especially, if you’re a first time, mum, give yourself a break, like get used to all the other stuff first, before putting this extra pressure on yourself. You can do cloth nappies from birth. Most cloth nappies are called birth to potty. So the idea is they will take you from birth to potty-training because they adjust in size as your baby gets bigger.

[00:03:34] Um, but they only really work on bigger babies in the first place. So your sort of nine, 10 pounders. Um, you can buy special newborn cloth nappies, but then that’s a whole second set of nappies that you’ve had to buy, which you’ll use for about three months. 

[00:03:49] Carla: Yeah, definitely. No, that makes sense 

[00:03:52] Lianne: It can be done, but it’s an extra cost. And can be a bit stressful.

[00:03:57] Carla: And I like how you said that about the pressure, because I think has a new mum when you first have a baby, there is so much pressure around you and when things don’t work out, you can sometimes feel like, oh, I’ve failed at that. You haven’t , you have had a baby. 

[00:04:12] Lianne: Yeah. It’s hard having a baby, especially your first baby is hard. Everything is new to get used to. So if I l was you as a first time mum, I would leave it a couple of weeks. Spend some time when you’ve got a baby asleep on your shoulder, spend some time doing some research, look online, look at forums, look at Facebook groups. Learn what you can learn about it, because it is a bit different to disposables. There is a bit more to get your head around. Once you’ve got it, you’re fine. 

[00:04:39] Carla: It’s just getting in that routine. Isn’t it? And just knowing what you’re doing. So, so yeah. Oh no, that makes a lot of sense. So how many then cloth nappies, would you start with? How many do you need?

[00:04:53] Lianne: If you were going to go for it and do cloth nappies all the time. You need about 20 or 25? Um, so that’s based on washing them every two to three days. 

[00:05:04] Carla: Okay. 

[00:05:06] Lianne: Babies are very different and they change as they get older. Um, but if the average baby’s getting through six to eight nappies a day that gives you three days worth of nappies plus a day to wash them and dry them.

[00:05:19] Carla: So you’d start with around that amount and do a lot of companies then have like a starter pack or do you buy them individually? Or how, how does it work?

[00:05:29] Lianne: Yeah, there’s loads of different ways of doing it. So at Green Cheeks, we do do a starter kit where you can buy 12 nappies all at once, um, at a discounted price because. Another thing you can sort of suggest to people when you’re getting used to cloth nappies is to start at home, just buy some, get used to using them at home because then you’ll get used to how long your baby needs, uh, before they need changing.

[00:05:58] Carla: Yes. 

[00:05:59] Lianne: Um, because with a cloth nappy, there are a lot less forgiving. Once they full they’re full, that’s it. Whereas a disposable nappy, you’ve got a lot more chemicals and things in there which are sucking the moisture away. But when you’ve got a nappy that is cotton or hemp or whatever it is, once that’s full, there’s nowhere else for it to go, it’s, it’s going to come out the sides. So you kind of get need to get to grips with. How long your baby will last before needing a change, um, averages out about two to three hours, the cloth nappies, but every baby is different. And just when you think you’ve nailed it, they will change the game. Cause they’ll get a bit older and they hold the wee for a bit longer or they’ll, or you’ll start weaning or something will change.

[00:06:42] Um, so I mean, every nappy change counts you could even if you just had one or two cloth nappies a day that will massively impact the amount of, um, disposables you are throwning away. So literally start with one, just to see how you get on with it. Or if you want to just go, go for it. You want about 25. 

[00:07:02] Carla: Yeah. So you can kind of do like a bit of combi nappying. So when you were at home, you can put your little one in these cloth nappies because you at home, it’s a bit easier sometimes. And do it that way just to start and then slowly kind of spread out to more, if you want to. 

[00:07:17] Lianne: Yeah. Cause you’ll grow in confidence as you get used to doing it. 

[00:07:21] Carla: Right. Okay. Yeah. Two to three hours doesn’t seem so bad at all. Really. I mean, I know every baby will be different. Um, but that doesn’t seem like I, I just wondered whether it was a constant flow at a young age of wee. I dont know.

[00:07:36] Lianne: There is a difference to, and what your nappy is made of. So like, um, generally you’ve got microfiber. These are things that the, the absorbent bits that are inside the nappy. So you’ve got microfiber, you’ve got bamboo, cotton and hemp are the four main components for the absorbent part of a nappy. Microfiber tends to be the cheaper end of the nappies not always the case, um, but actually holds the least amount of liquid. So the, and in general, the higher you go up the absorbency. The more wee you’re going to hold the longer they will last. There’s something to be said for combining absorbances,you combine, um, microfibre with a hemp, for example, inside the nappy. And then by doubling up, you’re helping with how much you are going to absorb. 

[00:08:31] Carla: Yeah, no, that makes a lot of sense. It’s quite a minefield, honestly, only because I personally, I use nappies, but I’m really into the kind of helping the environment and looking into it and stuff like that. Cause I’m expecting at the moment. Yeah, it does interest me like how, it seems like there’s a lot to it, but really it is just replacing that nappy and just learning. But yeah, it is a bit different in terms of keeping an eye on it. So, so the benefits of cloth nappies, I mean, I can think of quite a few off the top of my head but can you share, share what, you know, cause you’ll know a lot more than I do.

[00:09:11] Lianne: Yeah. So one of the big things is cost. So, um, the average baby from birth to potty training saying that potty training is at around three years old. We use about 5,000 nappies, 5,040. I worked out the last time I did the maths. Um, and if you work that out in terms of premium brand nappies. That will cost you about a thousand pounds in nappies over those over those three years, um, 25 Green Cheeks nappies with boosters. So double the amount of absorbency would cost you 345 pounds. So, that’s a, there is a big cost saving there.

[00:09:52] Carla: Thats huge yeah.

[00:09:53] Lianne: The same nappies for your second, third, fourth. However many kids you have that then that cost gets even, even less. Um, plus once you have potty-trained you’ve done it. There’s a resale value to nappies you can there’s loads of, um, Facebook marketplace deals. So you can sort of recoup some of your costs once you finished potty-training and it gets some costs back that way as well. So you can really drive the cost down of your nappies.

[00:10:23] Wow. That’s 

[00:10:24] Carla: amazing. I didn’t realize that even existed. That’s really good. 

[00:10:28] Lianne: Yeah. Money-wise is a big thing.

[00:10:30] Carla: Yes of course.

[00:10:32] Lianne: Environmental factors. So rough stats, 7 million trees are cut down every year to make disposable nappies. Cause they are all, most of what’s inside is all like, um, paper pulp, which is, which is in there so loads of nappies. Lots of people argue that, um, does the environmental factor really weigh up. Like if you’re washing nappies, does that really work out much better? Um, it actually takes nine gallons of water to make one disposable nappy.

[00:11:06] Carla: Oh my goodness. 

[00:11:08] Lianne: I should have checked, but modern washing machines these days, I don’t think even use that much to, um, wash all your nappies. So you consider, consider that as you environmental. 

[00:11:20] Carla: Yeah goodness. 

[00:11:22] Lianne: And then there’s all the other raw materials that go into making disposables. It is just a lot more, is used for disposables and then you jus throw them in the bin.

[00:11:32] Carla: And then also, I suppose it’s the baby’s skin as well. Isn’t it? 

[00:11:35] Lianne: Yeah another big one because there’s no chemicals. You, nappy rash is very rare. Um, infection, very rare. Um, there is an argument for cloth nappy babies, potty train easier. 

[00:11:50] Carla: Yeah, that would be, I did wonder that actually I thought that might be the case. 

[00:11:55] Lianne: And it’s something to do with, because they’ve been used to. Disposable nappies, the chemicals in them suck away any moisture so the baby is left, feeling dry all the time. With cloth nappies there is like a liner in them, but the back left feeling a bit more damp than what they would’ve done. So when it comes to potty training that can ease the process.

[00:12:16] Carla: They would know that they, um, they need changing really wouldn’t they, I suppose.

[00:12:22] Lianne: And then become more aware of it. 

[00:12:24] Carla: Yeah, no that does make sense. 

[00:12:27] Lianne: Oh, landfill is not the big one. 

[00:12:28] Carla: Oh yes. Yeah. 

[00:12:30] Lianne: Yeah. 3 billion nappies we send to landfill every year and they take about 500 years to decompose. The whole time they’re in there, they’re releasing methane gases. 

[00:12:42] Carla: Oh my God. 

[00:12:43] Lianne: Lots of environmental factors to consider. 

[00:12:46] Carla: So by even, even if someone was thinking of not going the full way with cloth nappies and they just wanted to even make a small difference to the environment and to their pocket as well, they could just do it at home. Cause for me like I think, oh God, this I’d be a bit nervous initially going out with it. But that’s not to say that you, like we said earlier, you could kind of start and then kind of progress as you go on. So that’s, that’s really interesting. So what’s the process then from kind of putting that cloth nappy on your baby to, you know, washing it, drying it, and then putting it back on again in a few days time.

[00:13:30] Lianne: So. Babies, babies in a wee, let’s do wee first cause that the easy one. 

[00:13:36] Carla: Oh yeah.

[00:13:41] Lianne: If it’s just wee all you need to do, you don’t need to soak it or bleach it or anything with it. All you do is take off the baby and store it somehow. So in a bag or a bucket or whatever you going to do with it, put it in there. And then two or three days time you’ll wash it. If there’s a poo in it. So before baby is weening. Don’t do anything, uh, pre-weaning baby poo is fully water-soluble, so you can chuck the whole thing poo and all in the washing machine. Once you start weaning things get a bit more, a bit more exciting. You then get the poo off before you wash it or you will just have turds in your washing machine. 

[00:14:27] Carla: Yeah, just floating around. Yeah. That’s probably happened to me before. Not me or my husband, probably my son actually. When the odd nappies been thrown in there and you don’t realize, oh yeah, that’s happened. 

[00:14:40] Lianne: But did you know. You know, pooey, nappies. It’s I know this is gross, but even with disposable nappies, you aren’t supposed to put poo in the bin, you’re supposed to take, the poo out before.

[00:14:49] Carla: Oh really?

[00:14:50] Lianne: Yeah you aren’t meant to send poo to landfill.

[00:14:53] Carla: Oh wow goodness.

[00:14:55] Lianne: No one does and no one really knows.

[00:14:58] Carla: Right. So show with the poo then what are you, what are you? What’s the right thing to do then with poo? I never thought I’d ask that question.

[00:15:08] Lianne: Hows your monday morning going?

[00:15:11] Carla: Its nearly lunchtime as well. I don’t know if I can handle it.

[00:15:16] Lianne: Once you’re into weaning. You’ll get to a point where it’s a normal poo. So you can just tip it down the toilet and it’ll fall off. Whereas in between stage when you’ll have to get a bit more, um, get your hands dirty, I suppose. But. With me, my shower head from the bath, will reach the toilet. So I would then get the shower head, put it on the jet mode and blast the poo off into the toilet.

[00:15:44] Carla: And it wouldn’t take long. I assume. It’s just like a quick thing.

[00:15:48] Lianne: And let’s be honest babies are pooey, smelly, sicky things anyway, like it’s not the most clean experience is it? When you are in motherhood. 

[00:15:57] Carla: No. Definitely not. I smelt of sick the whole time. Yeah. Yeah. No, that, that makes sense. So it’s just finding the thing that works for you really, I suppose, in that sense.

[00:16:07] Lianne: Yeah. Yeah. You can either scrape it off or squirt it off or it’ll fall off.

[00:16:11] Carla: Pick it off. Well not with your hands.

[00:16:13] Lianne: You can also liners too. You can get liners that you put inside the nappy. So when it’s those, you take the liner out.

[00:16:19] Carla: Oh that’s. Yeah. So there’s quite a few options in terms of that. So once they’ve gone in the bucket, you know, when you talk about this bucket, does the bucket have water in or anything, or?

[00:16:29] Lianne: No.

[00:16:30] Carla: Just an empty bucket. So they’re in there. And then when it’s time to wash. When you’ve got a few in there, what, what’s the process then? 

[00:16:39] Lianne: So it chuck them all in the machine and put it on a cold wash for your shortest wash, about 20 minutes, half an hour. Cold wash. What that will do is clear out the wee from inside the fabric. And then, um, after doing a cold wash, go again, um, a long hot wash in you’re washing machine. It’s really important to check, um, your washing powder dosage, because it varies so much between hard water and soft water and the size of your washing machine. So you need to check all that out to make sure they’re using the right amount of powder for your circumstances. Because these are the dirtiest thing you ever gonna wash. So you’ve go to use the right amount of washing powder for it. And you can, if you weren’t doing full-time nappies, you only had like five to wash, for example, you can put anything else in there with it. So maybe clothes or flannel towels, or bulk the wash up. The other thing you shouldn’t do is don’t use fabric softener, it coats the fabrics, actually makes it repel. Um, liquid. 

[00:17:50] Carla: Oh, wow. Right. Okay. So you shouldn’t use those. Um, is there any washing powder that you shouldn’t use that’s going to damage these or, or harm the lifetime of these, these cloth nappies? 

[00:18:02] Lianne: Oh yeah. There’s all, there’s all sorts of minefield of information about wash powder. In general, we recommend non bio. You’ll get a different answer with everyone that you ask. 

[00:18:15] Carla: Yes. No, that’s fine. That makes sense. 

[00:18:18] Lianne: I would say use non bio and don’t use stain removers or bleach on them because that can damage the fibres. Washing cloth nappies is one of the most contentious topics in the cloth. nappy kingdom. 

[00:18:32] Carla: Yeah I bet, I bet. It’s just, yeah, until, you know, you’re just not sure are you? But with, with the, um, so once the nappies have been washed are they often hung out to dry, or can you put them in the dryer or would you put them on radiators? How would you dry them? 

[00:18:50] Lianne: You can tumble dry them on low. Um, obviously, in terms of being environmentally friendly, outside on the line is the best way for it, but winter that ain’t going to happen. So you can tumble dry it. It can go on the radiator. Um, the only thing to be aware of on radiators is, um, any plastic parts avoid putting those directly on the radiator because if it gets to hot you will end up melting the thing, but yeah. You can get these, you know, the things you get for hanging socks up?

[00:19:17] Carla: Yeah.

[00:19:18] Lianne: Those are good.

[00:19:19] Carla: Oh yeah, of course. So you could, I suppose if you’ve got a maiden and you just put it, we’ve got a boiler cupboard you see that gets really hot, so you could just kind of store it in there. Couldn’t you? Put them in there. Right. Okay. That’s great. That’s interesting. So it actually sounds like a pretty simple process really.

[00:19:39] Lianne: Yeah because they wee, you wash it, put it back together again and off you go. 

[00:19:45] Carla: Thats it. Great. So how often do you think then you need to buy a new set of cloth nappies? Do they, do they go up in, in what sizes?

[00:19:55] Lianne: So if. Your average baby. If you’re starting at about eight weeks and you’ve got like a 14 pound baby by then, and I don’t know how quick, babies get bigger these days, mines three now. So I’ve forgotten, what size they were. But if you’re starting from about a 10 pound baby, up to the age of about three, the sale set of nappies will do you for that entire time, you won’t need to buy any bigger ones.

[00:20:22] Um, if you. Potty training doesn’t go so well. And the child gets older or they’re not dry at night, then you’re going to need to think about that when you get to three and there are nappies out there for bigger children, um,but in general, your birth to potty nappies.

[00:20:39] Carla: Wow.

[00:20:41] Lianne: Yeah, cause they have, um, you have a thing on the front. They have these like little, I know this is going to be a podcast, but there’s a thing on the front so that you can take it down from being its smallest, which is that 

[00:20:57] Carla: Oh so you’ve got, is it like a clip or button? 

[00:21:00] Lianne: Yeah its like poppers on the front of it. So you like clip it, that’s its smallest size. 

[00:21:03] Carla: Oh right. Great. 

[00:21:05] Lianne: And as the baby gets bigger. You undo, you undo those and that’s its biggest.

[00:21:08] Carla: Oh wow great.

[00:21:10] Lianne: So yeah. So, so one, one of those would do you. 

[00:21:14] Carla: Oh, yeah, so basically you can just grow. They grow with the baby then. So that’s, that’s even more cost-effective. 

[00:21:21] Lianne: Yeah you haven’t got to buy a different set for when they get to one or whatever, it’s the same, the same set. 

[00:21:27] Carla: Do you know what it’s probably always, even if you’re thinking cloth nappies and for someone, you know, anyone listening to this, even if you’re not thinking it’s not for you yet, we’ve all had. Well probably not everyone because there’s a lot of organized, super organized people out there. But I have at times that I’ve gone, like to put a nappy on my little boy and I’m like, uh oh, where are they. So I think cloth nappies are a great option to have anyway. You know, like, even if you’re not going to be doing it all the time, you’d never know when you’re going to need one, put it in your changing bag and things like that. And it just, um, That’s great, but obviously this, this podcast. We want to encourage people to be more environmentally friendly. And also there are so many, so many options, really. So I guess your main advice then, what would you say if you were thinking about starting out? 

[00:22:21] Lianne: So give it a go. Buy a couple. Um, I wouldn’t go out and buy a 25 all in one go. Research a couple of brands, buy a couple, um, and try it out at home. Um, you can also hire them, you know, there’s um, across the UK is a whole chain of nappy libraries so that you can actually find someone locally. Were you can borrow their nappies for four weeks. Um, so you can try out, um, I’m actually a part of this group called The Cloth Collective. We’ve just started a nationwide hire group. Eight small brands and we put together this kit, you can hire it from us for 30 days. So you get to try all these. In it is every, every single different type of nappy that exists from eight different small business. 

[00:23:10] Carla: That’s great. That’s lovely that you’re all in it together.

[00:23:15] Lianne: Yeah.

[00:23:15] Carla: I love that.

[00:23:16] Lianne: Eight mums, all work at home mums, all that want to make a positive change to the world and the cloth nappy community. So we, yeah, we put together. We only launched it a month ago? Maybe not even that.

[00:23:29] Carla: That’s brilliant. Great. Oh, that’s really interesting. So I think that’s covered everything, but, um, Lianne, could you tell us a bit more about your brand and where, where when you started and also where people can find your, your nappies? 

[00:23:45] Lianne: Yeah. Yep. So Green Cheeks, um, was born out of my own cloth nappy journey with my son. I knew when I was pregnant, I wanted to use cloth nappies, but I didn’t have the faintest idea about it. I, I thought I was the only person in the whole world that had this crazy idea. So, um, the nappies that I bought to start with were very close to being absolutely useless. Um, but it’s, it took me a while to find my way onto forums and websites to sort it out.

[00:24:14] Um, and what I found, the sort of nappies that I wanted to use, um, didn’t quite exist. So we always preferred Velcro fastening ones because they are much more like a disposable to put on. Cause they the alternative is ones that pop like snap together. Um, most of those that I found that are out there didn’t have a very high level of absorbency inside them.

[00:24:42] So Green Cheeks are mostly an easy to use Velcro nappy, um, but the absorbent material inside is hemp, which is one of the most absorbent fabrics there are. Plus one of the most environmentally friendly ones to grow as well, hemp. But yeah, so it’s really easy to use but highly absorbent and not be stupidly expensive.

[00:25:07] So they start from £9.85 for one nappy, and that gets you, um, easy to use with hemp nappies inside. And they’re online it’s is my website and it’s Green Cheeks Cloth Nappies on social media, if you want to follow me for general nappy nonsense.

[00:25:29] Carla: No, thats great. Really interesting. So thank you so much for coming on today to talk to us anyway, because it’s definitely a question. I’ve had these questions for so long in my mind thinking, and it’s just good to kind of have them all answered. If anyone else has got any questions, I’m sure Lianne would be happy to answer.

[00:25:48] Lianne: Yeah yeah. Send me an email, or message or find me. 

[00:25:50] Carla: Oh, perfect. So thank you so much for being our guest today anyway. 

[00:25:54] Lianne: Thank you for having me. It’s been great. Thank you. 

[00:25:56] Carla: Thank you. 

[00:25:58] Thank you for listening to My Bump 2 Baby’s expert podcast. If you would like to find help and support from experts in your local area, head over to and you will also be able to find local pregnancy to preschool groups, classes, businesses, and services in your local area.

The post The Benefits of Cloth Nappies appeared first on MyBump2Baby Podcasts.

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Sleep Regression Wed, 29 Sep 2021 08:47:03 +0000 Today host Carla Lett speaks with child sleep expert Jemma Munford on sleep regression.
Jemma answers all of your questions on the dreaded sleep regressions, this includes;
What is sleep regression?
What are the signs of the sleep regression?
When does sleep regression happen?

The post Sleep Regression appeared first on MyBump2Baby Podcasts.

  • Sleep Regression

Today host Carla Lett speaks with child sleep expert Jemma Munford on sleep regression. 

Jemma answers all of your questions on the dreaded sleep regressions, this includes;

What is sleep regression?

What are the signs of the sleep regression?

When does sleep regression happen?

Why does sleep regression happen?

What are your top tips for surviving sleep regression?

Can you avoid sleep regression?

Blissed out Babies Social Links:


Facebook :

Instagram : @blissedoutbabies

Wonder Weeks App :

[00:00:00] Carla: This podcast is sponsored by My Bump 2 Baby Family Protection and Legal Directory. To find your nearest advisor or family law, solicitor, head over to

[00:00:20] Hello and welcome to My Bump 2 Baby Expert Podcast, where we bring experts from all over the UK. To answer your questions on everything, pregnancy to preschool. Today, we are talking about a topic that many parents want answers to, and that is sleep regression. My guest today is Jemma Munford from Blissed out Babies. I hope you enjoy this episode.

[00:01:09] Hello everybody and welcome to My Bump 2 Babies Expert Podcast. Today, I am joined by sleep expert, Jemma Munford, and Jemma is part of Blissed out Babies. And today we’re going to be talking all about sleep regression. So hello, Gemma, how are you? 

[00:01:31] Jemma: Hi, Carla, I’m great. Really happy to be here, to talk about what lots of parents worry about. Um, and hopefully offer some tips. 

[00:01:39] Carla: Brilliant. Sleep regression is a subject I see so many parents talking about regularly or a lot of the time mentioning in the four month sleep regression, but actually it’s so much more than that. So I’m really looking forward to speaking to you on this subject. Um, so Jemma, can we start with, what is sleep regression?

[00:01:59] Jemma: So I suppose in its ultimate definition of sleep regression is where sleep gets worse. Or goes back to how it was before. Now the term of regression is a bit of a complex one really because actually what’s going on in our little babies or our child or our toddler is that they’re actually progressing in some sort of development or the brain’s growing or something is growing or changing rather than regression would say getting worse or going backwards. So actually it’s a progression rather than a regression, but it’s often a period of time that where asleep does go out the window a little bit. 

[00:02:37] Carla: Yeah. Yes. We know about that as parents don’t we? So what are the signs of sleep regression then?

[00:02:45] Jemma: So commonly, you’ll see things like your child might start fighting naps. So what might’ve been an easy kind of reasonably consistent, predictable routine. Suddenly goes out of the window, you know, 10 o’clock they usually nap, no today they are kind of kicking off a bit, having a cry, um, maybe not even, not even tired. Um, they might, so they might be fighting naps. Bedtime, sometimes can go in a similar way. So if you’ve previously had quite a simple, smooth bedtime, and your baby seems ready to go to sleep, all of a sudden, they’re fighting bedtime as well, don’t appear to be tired. And sometimes it will mean that they’ll wake a lot more overnight as well. Um, all the fun things. 

[00:03:29] Carla: Oh yeah. The thing is, it’s hard, isn’t it for parents because you know, they do. I mean, George, he used to have two naps, like one in the morning, one in the afternoon, and sometimes it’s hard to know are they just growing out of their naps or is this just kind of part of the sleep regression? Really? 

[00:03:44] Jemma: Yeah. I would say if, um, if everything’s previously been working well and all of a sudden, they start fighting the second nap, if they have a nap in the morning. That might be time to just reduce that morning nap to see if the second nap still happens. So if you have a fiddle around with timings and it’s still happening, then highly likely that it’s going to be some sort of developmental or sleep regression, um, that that’s impacting their sleep. So sleep regressions often happen for two to four weeks at a time. So, um, if it’s just a day or so, then it’s probably nothing, but if it’s consistently happening, it could be a sleep regression. 

[00:04:27] Carla: Right. Okay. So, so when does sleep regression happened in a baby, toddlers, child’s life? 

[00:04:36] Jemma: So we’ll keep it to the first couple of years just for the, for this podcast, because we could talk about it a long time. But essentially the common time you’ll, everyone will have heard of is the four month sleep regression. And actually that can happen anywhere between three and six months. There’s often a little blip around six months, eight months ish. 10 months, ish dare I say it, 12 months as well. And then often 14 to 18 months. That can be a little bit of a tricky period as well. And the things to look out for is if your child’s learnt a new skill. So say they are chatting a lot more or, or they started rolling or crawling any of those big, major developments that you can really tell, um, they learnt a fantastic new skill, often sleep will be impacted and it’s because so much is going on in the brain. Um, but yeah, the most common one people have heard of is a four month sleep regression. Um, but actually it happens between three and six. So that’s not even very predictable either. 

[00:05:39] Carla: Yeah. I’ve seen a lot of people talk about that one or perhaps that’s the one that people know more about.

[00:05:44] Jemma: I think so. And I think, um, naturally when, you know, there’s lots of mums chatting together, cause you go and start at a baby group. I think it’s just more spoken about, because naturally there’s lots of mums going through that same thing at the same time. Um, and interestingly, the four month sleep regression is very different to the others. Um, some of the others are related to gross motor skills like walking or, um, or, or speech coming in or separation anxiety. The first one, the four month sleep regression is more about, um, how our sleep architecture changes.

[00:06:19] So. Instead of children having deep sleep, light, sleep, deep sleep, light sleep, which happens from newborn. Um, up until about this time, they start to have a sleep cycle thats a little bit more like an adult. So it goes through lots of different stages of sleep. Um, and it’s a huge, it’s the biggest change to our sleep structure that we go through as humans. So it’s quite significant sometimes, but that one is slightly different to the others, which are more developmental related. 

[00:06:48] Carla: Oh, wow. Right. Oh, I see what you mean oh this sounds interesting. So, so I know you covered it a little bit with the, um, with them changing and reaching. What’s the word milestones, but is that why sleep regression happens then? Or can there be other factors? 

[00:07:06] Jemma: Yeah. So often, often it is related to developmental change. So things like rolling crawling, they take a huge amount of brain power. Um, and often our little ones want to practice these things in the night. Did you, did you ever get with George that he’d be rolling around in the middle of the night or trying to pull up to stand in his cot when he should be laying down.

[00:07:26] Carla: Oh Yes. Yes. I know. That’s it? Yeah. Just, just being George basically. Yeah, I know exactly what you mean.

[00:07:34] Jemma: Even when the chatting, you know, that vocabulary is coming in, you know, they just can’t help themselves and the just want to chat away. So all these little things. It takes a lot of brain power and that can impact, how they settle. Sometimes sleep can obviously be impacted by other things. So it could be that they’re feeling unwell, maybe they’re teething, um, things like that. But. They will usually pass a lot sooner. Um, often, often a little bit quicker than a usual sleep regression, which I would say, like I say, probably two to four weeks usually. Um, if it sooner that it passes, that’s great. Um, but often you’re in for a couple of weeks, at least I would say. 

[00:08:16] Carla: Yeah, that’s great. So, so, so what, what would be your top tips for surviving sleep regression? I bet you get asked this a lot.

[00:08:27] Jemma: I do yeah, I do and you know, sometimes in the sleep coaching process, Um, you know, if I’m work, if I’m working one-to-one with a client for a couple of months, sometimes in the middle of that period, there’ll be a sleep regression. And actually often we might need to pause what we’re doing. Because if you think about it, there’s so much going on in your baby’s brain they’re learning, how it’s a roll, which involves so many different muscles and coordinating that they’ve got the intention to do it. They’ve got the strength to do it. There’s a lot that’s going on there.

[00:08:59] If you then start trying to change the routine or how you settling them to go to sleep, or something, you know, significant like that there’s too much going on there. And actually you’re probably going to do a lot of hard work for no result. So if you’re expecting that your baby might come to the four month sleep regression sometime soon, it’s really nice to get into some really good sleep habits first.

[00:09:24] So if, if you’re in an nice bedroom, you’ve got a nice bedtime routine. If you’ve kind of having, just about the right amount of sleep in the day, you know, you’ve got some good practice, like having it dark at nighttime and having it nice and bright in the daytime, um, and following all their sleep cues, um, that is really good sleep hygiene. And it’s fantastic to have that in place before the regressions hit, because you’re already got those things that are going to help, um, other things, uh, just making sure that you’re able to rest because actually. Dealing with a child in a sleep regression. It’s very tiring. Isn’t it? I mean, I, I remember with my two, my, my daughter’s eight month sleep regression, which was pretty tough, um, and actually it impacted me more the did her, I think, because I was just so exhausted.

[00:10:16] So. Making time to get some rest in the daytime. If your nighttime is awful, which it can be. Is a really good tip. So try and have some time where you’re doing something for yourself that you feeling like, you know, it’s not relentless looking after your baby all the time. Try and get a bit of a break so you’ve got some time to yourself.

[00:10:38] Um, And just, just look at things like, are they having enough sleep in the day? Are they having, um, are their wake windows about, right. So they’re not too tired, they’re not over tired. Cause some of those things can impact the night and it can look like a sleep regression, but perhaps it’s not. So just having a look at their sleep needs as well and just make each other that your child’s getting what they need. But look after yourself, get help if you can and try and rest in the daytime, if the nighttime’s awful 

[00:11:06] Carla: Yeah. Yeah, no, that’s great advice. Um, so another question for you, can you avoid sleep regression? 

[00:11:16] Jemma: So I would say probably not. Naturally there are going to be some children who just sail through these developments and it has no impact on their sleep. I mean, very rarely do I come across a parent with a baby that has slept brilliantly from very tiny, all the way through childhood. Just, you know, those do exist I’m sure Unicorn children. So you know what you can’t avoid it, for every single development. Um, but the thing to remember is it might not be as bad as you think.

[00:11:53] So what I would say to mums and dad who were perhaps worried about regressions is don’t worry about it. Don’t anticipate that it’s this all of a sudden everything’s going to be terrible. Cause actually it might not be and you’re worrying for no reason. So I would say, just make sure that you’re doing those, you know, good sleep hygiene things. Making sure you, you know, you’re, you’re in a good, in good routine, good habits with your baby. Um, and you’re in the best position there for it not to impact as much hopefully. Um, but no I don’t think you can run. 

[00:12:27] Carla: No, you might be one of the lucky ones though. You might be. And but yeah, I think a lot of parents seem to worry about it cause they hear about it and it’s like, oh god, the storm is coming. 

[00:12:38] Jemma: Absolutely. And I think we’ve got the wonder weeks app haven’t you your where you can actually see the storm coming.

[00:12:43] Carla: Oh wow, oh I didn’t know that?

[00:12:46] Jemma: So the Wonder Weeks is a fantastic book. In fact, this is how much I like the wonder weeks book. Yeah so if you are watching on video then, um, that is a great book and you can you can have it as an app and it just, um, In the app, it’s got a little diary, so you can see where big changes in development are happening. It doesn’t mean that there’ll be a sleep regression at that time, but what’s handy in that app is you can kind of see what’s going on with your baby and why there might be a bit grumpy at that time. It’s really interesting.

[00:13:16] Carla: Oh, that’s really useful. Thank you for that. So, so Jemma, obviously you offer sleep help. So can you tell us how you work with clients? Because I know a lot of people have different ways that they want to work with you. So you’ve got a few different, different ways, haven’t you? 

[00:13:32] Jemma: Yeah, absolutely. So, um, yeah, so, um, um, I’ve got the highest level of qualifications you can get in sleep coaching. Um, and I’ve been doing this for three or four years now, so. 

[00:13:42] Carla: Oh wow. Well done.

[00:13:43] Jemma: Thank you. And I do it because I am rubbish when I get no sleep. So, you know, I, and I have total empathy with my clients because I’ve got a sleeper and a non sleep in my children. So, um, you know, I try and cover all bases with the way I run my business. So you can work with me. One-to-one where, um, you will send me a sleep diary. I’ll have a look at what’s going on.

[00:14:05] We’ll chat through how you live your lives. Um, what your goals are and we put a plan in place, and then I support you and handhold you through implementing that plan. So that’s kind of the top level. Um, the middle level is, um, some group coaching so I do probably once, four times a year. I tend to open my group coaching up to, um, a small group of parents who work together to go through the process.

[00:14:30] Carla: Oh thats nice.

[00:14:31] Jemma: It’s really supportive. Um, you get a little Facebook group where you can all chat, um, and we work together in that. So that was great. And then I’ve got my online stuff as well. So I’ve got a range of online sleep courses where people could just purchase online, work through it at their own pace. And if you do want to get some support from me directly, after doing that, then you get a discount on the, um, the one-to-one as well. So that’s the DNA sleep program, which is online.

[00:15:00] Carla: Yes. We’ve done a review on that, actually one of our area managers absolutely loved it because it worked for her because she just said she wanted to work through something and do it that way.And its so cost-effective, um, you know, I was just saying to you before it’s cheaper than a night in a hotel, so, you know, it’s, it’s brilliant. It’s a really good way to do it, but that’s brilliant. Thank you so much for answering all of those questions. It will help a lot of people. So Jemma, can you just remind people where they can find you? 

[00:15:33] Jemma: Absolutely. Yeah. So I am actually based in Manchester, but work online. So if you’re a northerner, uh, feel free to drop me a message and maybe we can meet up for a coffee. If not, then you can catch me at Blissed out Babies, and I’m on Instagram and Facebook, and you can see my website too. I’ve got loads of free resources on the website for people needing help. 

[00:15:54] Carla: Oh, that’s brilliant. So, um, I’ll put those links on the end of this podcast, so everyone’s got them. So thank you so much, Jemma. That was really useful.

[00:16:02] Jemma: Thanks Carla. 

[00:16:03] Carla: Thank you. 

[00:16:05] Thank you for listening to My bump 2 Baby’s Expert Podcast. If you would like to find help and support from experts in your local area, head over to and you will also be able to find local pregnancy to preschool groups, classes, businesses, and services in your local area.

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